Rose Cottage, Whitecroft (General)

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Friday, November 30, 2018, 15:53 (373 days ago)

My grandfather, Cyril Egbert MORGAN was born in Rose Cottage, Whitecroft in 1897. I understand that his father, William Enoch MORGAN (registered as William Enoch MORGANS), had also been born there in 1865, and also his father (my GGGF) Enoch Morgan in 1835. His father, also Enoch Morgan, was born in Morriston, Swansea in 1803. At that time Enoch Morgan was a very common name, so unable to trace my Morgan family line via baptism records any further back at present.
William Enoch MORGAN died in 1945 and the house was sold. I understand that when my father used to spend his summer holidays there in the 1930s that the house was surrounded by trees, but sometime after 1945 the trees were all cut down and the house pebble-dashed. I saw it when my grandfather died in 1967, but cannot remember how I got there. Like most 18-year olds, as I was at the time, I didn't really pay that much attention to things like that.
Can anyone tell me if the house is still standing and if so where is it?

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by ChrisW @, Friday, November 30, 2018, 19:27 (373 days ago) @ Clements Tump

Hello

I don't know if it is the one you want, but there is a Rose Cottage in Grove Road, Whitecroft.

https://www.doogal.co.uk/ShowMap.php?postcode=GL15%204QL


Regards

Chris W

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Friday, November 30, 2018, 20:28 (373 days ago) @ ChrisW

That one's quite a modern house and there's no building in the same location on maps of the period so I don't think it's a rebuild.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by MPGriffiths @, Friday, November 30, 2018, 20:03 (373 days ago) @ Clements Tump

This is the addresses on the same page (1939 Census) -

All Whitecroft, Nr Lydney

High Holm
Park Hill
Sunny croft
Woodland Villa
ROSE COTTAGE
Lyndal
Bream View
? (can't read)
Lingdale
Bridge House


1939 Register for MORGAN

William E - born 25 November 1865 - Colliery Manager retired.
Ruth - 12 December 1868 - Unpaid Domestic Duties
Gwendoline - 21 September 1890 - School Mistress (Cert)
Grace E F - 11 May 1892 - Unpaid Domestic Duties

Ancestry PROBATE

MORGAN William Enoch of Rose Cottage, Whitecroft, Near Lydney, died 3 April 1945.
Probate Gloucester to Gwendoline Elizabeth Ruth MORGAN and Grace Eulalie Florence MORGAN, Spinsters.
Effects: £949 14s 9d.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Friday, November 30, 2018, 20:40 (373 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

There's a Parkhill Cottage and a Parkhill Lodge on old maps but I can't see any of the others.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Friday, November 30, 2018, 20:52 (373 days ago) @ Clements Tump

Of no help but found these references at the BNA:

Cheltenham Chronicle - Saturday 28 July 1923
Lydney Mining Prize.—Mr. Harold Morgan. fourth son of Mr and Mrs. E. Morgan, of Rose Cottage, Whitecroft, near Lydney, is the winner this year of the valuable chief prize offered by tile committee of the Forest of Dean Mining Classes. It consists £100 a year for two years, with tuition at upto-date mining colliery and facilities for pursuing mining studies at leading mining college. Sir. Morgan has beeu employed at the Princess Royal. He has specialized in pumping activities. Last year he missed winning eovetcd honour by narrow margin. His elder Drother, Cyril, won this same, prize three years ago. Another brother, John, also succeeded some years ago in reaching the top of the list Mr. W. C. Morgan, seuior, twice distinguished himself as mining student in that he caiue out at tho top of the lists for two years succession.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 09 January 1932
THROWN TO HIS HEAD. Mr. W. K. C. Morgan, # Rose Cottage, Whitecroft, was severely injured when the motor cycle was riding to Cinderford skidded on tho greasy road at Parkend. Morgan was thrown his head and received severe cuts and slight concussion. was afterwards conveyed his home, following medical attention, by a private motor car.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 07 November 1914
GLOUCESTER'S ROLL OF HONOUR. - Morgan, Cyril C., Rose Cottage, Whitecroft, Lydney.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 12 June 1926
BEES for Sale; strong early swarms.— Apply W. E. Morgan, Rose Cottage, Whitecroft. Lydney. Glos.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by RogerrGriffiths @, Swindon, Saturday, December 01, 2018, 09:00 (373 days ago) @ probinson

Rose Cottage, Grove Road, Whitecroft, GL15 4QL. If the right one, tried to find pic. but can't be sure the correct one. Zoopla are currently advertising it, but no pic.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Mike Pinchin @, Bedford, England, Saturday, December 01, 2018, 12:03 (372 days ago) @ Clements Tump

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.7565845,-2.5472298,165m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en

Go north-west into Grove Road and follow the track which branches off to the right almost immediately. Click on the first or second of three houses on the right (the small house in the middle) and the name Rose Cottage will come up. It’s not possible to get a clear sight of the second from the street view.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Saturday, December 01, 2018, 14:31 (372 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin

Thanks Mike. Clicking on the first house in the lane off Grove Road gets Rose Cottage, with its sizeable plot. The second house is too small. There has been considerable development since 1967!
There used to be a small hill nearby, with the remains of an old powder store (for blasting powder) which had a thick curved roof, but I cannot see this on Google map. It must have been nearby as it was within short walking distance as this was where my father put his father's ashes in 1967, to be overlooking Rose Cottage.
Anybody got any ideas where that might have been?

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by MPGriffiths @, Saturday, December 01, 2018, 14:37 (372 days ago) @ Clements Tump

The houses after William Enoch - addresses listed as Chapel Tump, Whitecroft - which I Googled yesterday - some sort of remains of earthworks etc .... l - will have to recheck

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 11:36 (372 days ago) @ Clements Tump

Do you remember anything about the house. Detached, semi, in a terrace? Or size, shape of the house or garden? It might help.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Saturday, December 01, 2018, 20:12 (372 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin

Earlier maps show no building being there Mike. It's a later development. Maybe it inherited the name.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Mike Pinchin @, Bedford, England, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 11:22 (372 days ago) @ probinson

This seems to be correct. I can’t match any buildings on old maps either. However, in the 1939 Register William E MORGAN is listed at Rose Cottage, Whitecroft (Schedule 146). Schedule 147 is “Lyndale” and Schedule 148 is “Bream View”. These are the two houses at the beginning of Grove Road and are immediate neighbours of Rose Cottage.

At the time of William’s baptism in 1866 the residence is given as Bream Tufts.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 11:58 (371 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin

Looking at Lyndale and Bream View from the front, it looks to me like that was originally three cottages. There's three gables that look old and one new one plus some other extensions. Maybe Rose Cottage was originally one of them but three became two and a new Rose Cottage was built.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by MPGriffiths @, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 12:37 (371 days ago) @ probinson

From LLoyds George Land Survey (1909-10)


GA/D2428/1/80/2 - Hereditament Number 2203

Place: West Dean

Income Tax parish: West Dean

Occupied by:

MORGAN William Enoch (M)

People holding the property:

MORGAN, William Enoch, Whitecroft (M) Owner

Owner occupied

PROPERTY:

Description: House and Garden

Address: Rose, Cottage, Whitecroft

POOR RATE:

Number: 2143

Size: 18 perches

Gross Value: £4 15s

Rateable Value: £3 10s.


(Should be on the link to the maps)

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 14:28 (371 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Map:

[image]

Which puts it on the other side of the road to where we thought. There's a building on that spot shown on old maps back to about 1880 but the present building is heavily updated. Difficult to tell how old it is.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Mike Pinchin @, Bedford, England, Sunday, December 02, 2018, 20:08 (371 days ago) @ probinson

Looking at the maps on the Old Maps site there doesn’t seem much change to the plot up until 1970 except that what seem to be some outbuildings have disappeared. By 1985 parts of it had evidently been sold off for development but the main building remained. The situation remained the same in 1991 but the plot was actually named on the map as Rose Cottage. Another outbuilding had appeared. The house we were concentrating on was named as Le Havre and not Rose Cottage.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by D I Elsmore @, Monday, December 03, 2018, 17:25 (370 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin

Looking at the maps on the Old Maps site there doesn’t seem much change to the plot up until 1970 except that what seem to be some outbuildings have disappeared. By 1985 parts of it had evidently been sold off for development but the main building remained. The situation remained the same in 1991 but the plot was actually named on the map as Rose Cottage. Another outbuilding had appeared. The house we were concentrating on was named as Le Havre and not Rose Cottage.

Hi Mike,I have used google maps to find Rose Cottage, it is clearly marked with its position and appears in the unmarked loop road off grove road post code given GL15 4QL it appears rose cottage is behind lyndale and bream view which backed off Rose Cottage land, the loop road unmarked continues on round joining grove road again lower down the road. Ivan

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Monday, December 03, 2018, 18:18 (370 days ago) @ D I Elsmore

Hi Ivan,

If you read back through the previous posts you'll see that house was already discussed but it doesn't seem to be the correct one. Google seems to have it wrong - not unheard of in my experience.

--
Peter

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Monday, December 03, 2018, 21:01 (370 days ago) @ probinson

Good evening all
Thank you very much for all your contributions.
The Lloyds George Land Survey and map confirm what was Rose Cottage.
Reviewing 25inch OS maps (on National Library of Scotland website) for 1881, 1903 and 1922, these are quite interesting. The 1881 map has plot no 1162 with a path running across the northern boundary. By 1903 the plot has no 1369 and covered 0.612 of an acre, with the same path marking the northern boundary. In the 1922 map there is now a plot 1077 of 0.220 acre with the initials WM on the map. Not sure if this refers to William Morgan but the old northern path seems to have disappeared. This is the same plot described as Hereditament no 2203 on the map produced by Peter.
When I was there is 1967 the house seems to be surrounded by a large expanse of grass enclosed in a chain link fence. I just wonder whether my GGF had encroached Dean Forest-style onto Forestry Commission land.
The plot marked 1162 and 1369 on the OS map.
Looking on Google maps and Streetview there are now a lot of houses built within 2203 but I am sure that Rose Cottage is the white house that is second on the left in Grove Road coming from Pillowell Road. it appears to have been built of stone, bearing in mind that both William Morgan's father Enoch and grandfather Enoch were stone masons, and was possibly built by the older Enoch. Today the house has a modern covering, but it has been cut to show the long-short of the building edges and the doors and windows. The far end is a modern extension, although it still has the long-short window edges. Looking at historical images on Google Earth it was not there in the 2006 image but it, and the garage, had been completed by the time of the 2010 image. Originally the house would have had a slate roof but now appears to have one of the ubiquitous concrete tiles.
Of course it may not now be called Rose Cottage.
If there is anyone local to Whitecroft perhaps they will know and could let us know.
Many thanks again.
Tony

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by D I Elsmore @, Tuesday, December 04, 2018, 14:03 (369 days ago) @ Clements Tump

Hi Clements Tump, In the forest of dean the people were very discrete and cagey/-careful, they very rarely had names or numbers displayed on their properties, only the postman knew, the post office or police station may not have known,locals might say its next to a oak free or fir tree, some were originally a lone cottage in the middle of a wood with no proper road only a track to start with, so even to-day you need to be a true forester yourself to find an address from the past even a Sat- Nav is useless as your enquiry proves to-day. Ivan

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Tuesday, December 04, 2018, 22:24 (369 days ago) @ D I Elsmore

I was merely asking if anyone knew what the house was called today. Having 3 out of the last 5 generations born, bred and died in the Forest, I am aware of how it was not necessary to have house or even road names, but as far as I can see this house was known as Rose Cottage from at least the 1850s for at least the next 120 years.

In the end I did a map search on the Land Registry website, which confirms that the white house second on the left in Grove Road from Pillowell Road is Rose Cottage, so it is nice to know that the present owners have continued the name.

That just about puts it to bed, so thanks again to everybody for all the help.

The FOD site has again proved its worth.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by dmcguinn9, Tuesday, January 01, 2019, 20:05 (341 days ago) @ Clements Tump

This is fascinating Tony. We share ancestors, my mum’s dad is Austin Kenneth Morgan. I would love to get in touch to discuss the family history. Best regards, Dave McGuinness

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Sunday, April 14, 2019, 01:34 (239 days ago) @ dmcguinn9

I am email enabled in the user area but you are not so I cannot contact you to further discuss family tree. I am equally interested in knowing more of my extended Morgan family.

Rose Cottage, Whitecroft

by Clements Tump @, Lowestoft, Saturday, September 21, 2019, 15:30 (78 days ago) @ dmcguinn9

Message for dmcguinn9
You are not email enabled in the user area, so unable to contact you.

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