John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield. (General)

by Griff @, Sunday, November 10, 2019, 20:40 (71 days ago)

Hi, can anyone help please. I'm looking for info on a burial date for John Jones who was born 12/07/1915 in Hewelsfield , I believe at home in Clifton cottage. His parents were Thomas and Annie May. I have found his baptism record in August of that year but I can't find his death or burial date.I know John didn't get married, he joined the army ta in 1939 and lived at Clifton Cottage all his life. Any help would be much appreciated.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Jefff @, West London, Middlesex, Monday, November 11, 2019, 00:34 (70 days ago) @ Griff

Hi Griff,
you probably already have the family on the 1939 Register, taken 29 September, c/o this weekend's free access. But if not;

1939 Register; Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield, Lydney District, Glos.
Thomas W Jones Male born 30/07/1880 Married Gardener
Annie M Jones Female born 06/05/1886 Married Unpaid Domestic Duties
John Jones Male born 12/07/1915 Single County Council labourer
Connie Jones Female born 27/06/1929 Single At School

The last entry has been amended to Constance Maureen Griffiths, plus her marriage date, possibly 1955.

----

With such a "common" name set, and no middle names, searching for later records is a real problem, as I'm sure you've found.
That said, it's possible he may have "adopted" a middle name, perhaps his father's, I've seen a few instances of this happening.

I've searched his death on FreeBMD and Ancestry, in Forest of Dean District as per your belief, without any obvious hit. A few near misses but nothing that seems correct.

It's possible his death took place in hospital, presumably Gloucester ?.
However there's still no obvious hits (based on his age & birth year) that I can see.

However sometimes errors happen, especially if he had no next-of-kin? to give precise birth info, perhaps ??.


Searching Ancestry for him in the Electoral Registers database which covers upto 1974, it gives him at Clifton Cottage for 1936, 1937 and 1938. However NOT after that, why !! ???.
Amongst the following umpteen pages of John Jones in Glostershire, there are just a few with no middle names, but not in the Forest area that I can see, some are married. These records give no clues as to age, sadly.


Searching Ancestry for Wills is equally unhelpful, as SO many of this name and none in our area.


Please Griff, are you sure you don't have any idea at all when he died ??.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 09:16 (70 days ago) @ Jefff

The family are still living at Clifton Cottage in 1966 (keep updating) - Constance leaves a bit earlier

?

There is a death - 1967, Newport, Monmouthshire: of Thomas W JONES aged 85 cc 1880

Gloucestershire England Electoral Register

Clifton Cottage

JONES

Annie M
Constance M
John
Thomas W


---

Freebmd

has

Marriage at Chepstow District 1956

Constance M JONES to Philip L GRIFFITHS

--

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Jefff @, West London, Middlesex, Monday, November 11, 2019, 12:32 (70 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thanks MPG !

Don't understand why I didn't spot that 1966 Electoral Register record, but very pleased you did !

Not the first time I've struggled to find a record on Ancestry if that's where it was, I need more practise on those ! - just aggravating as was only a few hours after it automatically offered me several similar records for my own trees.

Cheers J


ps searching a death for Annie May Jones, b1886 wrt the 1939 Register, this is by far the most likely fit that I can find in our Glos/Monmouthshire area;

Name: Annie M Jones
Death Age: 85
Birth Date: abt 1883
Registration Date: Jul 1968
[Aug 1968]
[Sep 1968]
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Forest of Dean
Inferred County: Gloucestershire
Volume: 7b
Page: 335

Cannot find this in the FoD PRs.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 13:06 (70 days ago) @ Jefff

The records are on Ancestry as

Gloucestershire, England, Electoral Registers 1832-1974

Name: Annie M, Clifton Cottage Jones

Residence Year: 1966

Parliamentary Division: West Gloucestershire

Residence Place: Gloucestershire, England


Page 159 of 476

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 13:51 (70 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Took some time .....

England & Wales, National Probate Calendar

Name: John JONES

Death date: 1 October 1981

Death Place: Hewlesfield, Lydney, Glos

Probate Date: 4 February 1982

Probate Registry: Llandaff


John JOHNS of Clifton Cottages, Hewlesfield, Lydney

died 1 October 1981, Probate Llandaff 4 February 1982

Not exceeding: £25,000


--

Although Hewlesfield Burials are on Ancestry : this goes up to 1981 - and only a few burials, no sign of John JONES

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 14:00 (70 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Had a quick look at British Newspapers on line (don't subscribe).
Not sure what the story is behind this......


BOUGHT GUN

.... amounting to criminal negligence. of the motor-cyclist. it was decided at the inquest at Gloucester yesterday. John Jones, of Clifton Cottage Hewlesfield. a cousin of the dead man, said they were walking home from a dance when the motor-cycle lame un behind ......

Published Tuesday January 1950
Newspaper: Western Mail
County: Glamorgan, Wales


?


Burial at Hewlesfield

13 January 1950

Stuary Henry JONES
residence: Grosmont Hewlesfield, St Briavels
aged 26


JONES Stuart Henry of Grosmont Hewlesfield, St Briavels, Lydney, Gloucestershire, died 9 January 1950 at The Royal Hospital Gloucestershire.
Adminstration Gloucester 10 October to Mary Jane JONES widow. Effects £2,027 19s 10d.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Monday, November 11, 2019, 15:11 (70 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

"Killed Returning From Dance
The death of Stuart Henry Jones, aged 26, of Grosmont, Hewelsfield, near Lydney, from injuries received on January 9, when he was knocked down by a motorcycle, was due to the negligence, not amounting to criminal negligence, of the motor-cyclist, it was decided at the inquest at Gloucester yesterday. John Jones, of Clifton Cottage Hewelsfield, a cousin of the dead man, said they were walking home from a dance when the motor-cycle came up behind and collided with them. He received only slight injuries. The motor - cyclist, Frederick Coles, of Tutshill, near Chepstow, said he pulled out to overtake the pedestrians and as he did so his pillion passenger slipped over to the right, throwing the motor-cycle off balance and into the pedestrians."

--
Peter

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 16:10 (70 days ago) @ probinson

???

Electoral Register 1937

Frederick John COLES - Sedbury Road, Tutshill, Chepstow

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Griff @, Monday, November 11, 2019, 21:17 (70 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

wow, unbelievable info! The lady you mention earlier, Constance, is my mother, who married my dad, Philip L Griffiths at Chepstow church. I have heard a story about one of the Jones's getting killed but I was lead to understand that he was riding the bike himself and fell off and uncle John carried him back to Clifton cottage, which shocked my grandma as you can imagine, he was covered in blood!
just goes to show how stories drift. Thank you for sorting that out for me, much appreciated. I notice that there was a mention of a Gun in a previous email thread?? is there any more information on that and my mum had a twin sister, Jean Eunice Jones, but she doesn't have a mention in the 1937 cencus?

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Tuesday, November 12, 2019, 07:12 (69 days ago) @ Griff

The gun story wasn't relevant. Just a quirk of the newspaper archive combining stories when it shouldn't.

--
Peter

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Griff @, Tuesday, November 12, 2019, 07:55 (69 days ago) @ probinson

ok, Thanks for all the feedback, it has been much appreciated and has answered a lot of questions for me about half heard stories.
I thought the Gun story would have been interesting, but glad that my Uncle John was not involved!!

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Tuesday, November 12, 2019, 09:08 (69 days ago) @ Griff

I can't see any baptisms for Constance Margaret JONES or Jean Eunice JONES (as you say they were twins)


Assume Thomas W JONES married Annie MORRIS

There is a big gap between children

-----


?
Looking at GloucestershireBMD/FreeBMD

There is


Constance Margaret JONES (mother's maiden name: MORRIS, 1929 Gloucester (Barnwood District which doesn't cover Hewelsfield) -

---

Jean Eunice JONES (mother's maiden name: HARRIS), September Qtr 1930, Forest of Dean, Chepstow, Lydney
Constance M JONES (mother's maiden name HARRIS - September Qtr 1930 - Chepstow


Connie on the 1939 census birth date given 27 June 1929

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Griff @, Tuesday, November 12, 2019, 20:01 (69 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Yes, you are correct, my mum and her twin sisters mother was Annie May Harris, ther birth date was 27/06/1930,so different to the date given on the 1939 cencus?

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Tuesday, November 12, 2019, 21:17 (69 days ago) @ Griff

Had a look at the 1939 census - and Connie is entry No. 4 in the household and the year 29 - has a faint 30 written above it.

- and the next entry has 'This record is officially closed -

so assume this is Jean (Connie's twin, is blanked out).

Can just about make out the bottom of the Surname J below the surname line, + the bottom of a J (through the line at the start of the Christian Name and ..... the J in the birth date colomn.....

The 4 Jones above, the J goes through the lines.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Jefff @, West London, Middlesex, Wednesday, November 13, 2019, 02:07 (68 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Apologies all for not transcribing the census as accurately as I should have done, the dangers of trying to do several different jobs at the same time, sorry !
Similarly sorry for not downloading the image to my pc as I should have done - I usually do in case its wanted.... this last week seems to be a classic case of the more I try to do things the more mistakes I make, ah well.

Thanks too MPG for spotting the amended birthdate; I wonder how often that happened, I've never seen that before.

Not saying its happened here, of course not, but I've seen a few cases where the dates given on the Register differ from that obtained from other records, eg death records.
Also cases where the official Death Record date differs from what the family believe is correct, in this case my Grandad's actual birthday wrt the record, and the date we all thought it was, including him haha.
Gotta keep on the ball on this job !

Apologies again Griff.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Griff @, Wednesday, November 13, 2019, 21:22 (68 days ago) @ Jefff

No need for apologies from anyone, the time effort and commitment that you all dedicate to this site is much appreciated by myself and undoubtedly everyone else who uses this site looking for answers to their past history.
So thank you.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by Griff @, Wednesday, November 13, 2019, 21:12 (68 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Hi, could you please tell me which online site you used to access the newspapers, that's the free site. thanks.

John Johns, Clifton Cottage, Hewelsfield.

by MPGriffiths @, Wednesday, November 13, 2019, 21:42 (68 days ago) @ Griff

British Newspapers on line

If you Google, and search the above website : a very brief description can be obtained (as per my contribution).

If you Register, you are entitled to view 3 Pages Free


----

If you belong to FindmyPast - this covers British Newspapers on line


Most local libraries have Ancestry/FindmyPast

RSS Feed of thread
powered by my little forum