abenhall baptisms (General)

by BelindaHill @, Sunday, March 22, 2020, 02:09 (186 days ago)

Can anyone tell me if the Abenhall or surrounding area baptisms exist (I know they don't online) for the years between 1740 and 1770. On Ancestry they start at 1762 but he was not anywhere there, which makes me think the earlier date. I am looking for the baptism of my ancestor Benjamin Moore born about 1755 (according to 1841 census and his burial in 1845) or alternatively 1763 area as his Marriage Allegation on here has him born around this latter date (although his age could have been mistranscribed). I can't look in person (or afford to pay someone) as I live in Australia. Would be so helpful if anyone could find out please. Thank you greatly.

abenhall baptisms

by probinson @, S. Oxon, Sunday, March 22, 2020, 11:37 (185 days ago) @ BelindaHill

Abenhall baptisms for those dates exist on this site's PRs though a quick search didn't find one that matched your ancestor.

--
Peter

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 05:49 (184 days ago) @ probinson

Thank you, neither could I hence my query.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Sunday, March 22, 2020, 18:19 (185 days ago) @ BelindaHill

As you belong to Ancestry, which has the Will of Benjamin MOORE - dated 1845 - listing his children, their wifes and grandchildren.... it would be useful to check this information against the baptisms, marriages on the Forest of Dean website.

For example,

Benjamin, mentions his Elder Son, John - and his wife Maria - who are on the 1841 Census with Benjamin

MOORE

Benjamin - 85
John - 45 - quarryman
Mary - 35 Ind
Benjamin - 15
Mary - 13
Timothy - 10
Jane - 9
William - 6
George - 3
James - 4months

?

Marriage of Samuel MOORE - 4 June 1827 to Maria HATTON

However,

Baptism at Abenhjall - 1 June 1828

John MOORE (parents: Samuel (John) in brackets and Maria


? Do they go by the name of Samuel or John


---

Talks about SIMMONDS and Betty his wife (his daughter) - christened 1789

etc etc


---

There will be family names, which pass through each generation.

---

Benjamin's first Wife Jane - appears to have been buried at Abenhall - 26 March 1802

and in 1805, Benjamine MOORE & Sarah PRIDE - have a daughter Ann - christened at Abenhall - 1805 - transript says by Sarah PRIDE

Thomas TEAGUE otherwise JONES - married to his daughter Mary

So cross checking the Will against the Forest of Dean records would be useful.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Sunday, March 22, 2020, 18:46 (185 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Assume you have noticed the witnesses at Benjamin MOORE's marriage to Jane BRIGHT - at Abenhall - 14 October 1788 -
witnesses: Tho(ma)s HAIL and Rich(ar)d LOWE

Marriage - 14 March 1789

Thomas HAIL aged 22, Batchelor, Blacksmith, residence: Longhope

married

Elizabeth BRIGHT - aged 21, Spinster, residence: LONGHOPE (again by Licence)


Then you can see by the baptism, the family names ....

e.g.

Baptisms at Longhope - Thomas & Elizabeth HAIL

Samuel, 1789, Jane 1791, etc etc.

---

? There is a baptism at Monmouth 21 December 1797, When Ann MOORE had a son Benjamin christened

? family connection
---

Benjamin who died in 1845 - seems quite a wealthy man.

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 06:04 (184 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thank you so much for the extra info you have found for me. I have traced Jane Bright his wife to parents and siblings. Elizabeth who married Thomas Hail, blacksmith, was her sister (I have not yet traced their children so thank you). They were born to James and Jane Bright who married in Longhope, had one kid there (Elizabeth) before moving to Weston under Penyard for quite a few years. Perhaps for work? James was a yeoman. I suspect they moved back to Longhope as there are no further Brights (marriages or burials) in this area, but there are certainly possibles in Longhope.

My main interest is Benjamin. I wonder how accurate the marriage allegation transcriptions are as he is also listed as a cordwainer, but later in life a labourer. Either way, how did he get so much land/money? Inherited perhaps, but I can't find a mention of a Benjamin on possible wills on ancestry. I thought if I could break my brickwall and find a possible baptism I may have been able to find where he was from and how he got the land when to my mind he was working class?? His son John Moore was my ancestor. John's son George Moore (1837-1902) were innkeepers in the New Inn (today the "Heart of Oak") in Drybrook.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 08:17 (184 days ago) @ BelindaHill

Looking at the Will, where Benjamin MOORE, left his Grandson, Benjamin MOORE the part of the land in his possession, the Cider Mill House and Cider Mill, and Bake house and oven (which Benjamin Snr built) and land each side of the Westbury brook.....

And the 1851 census
Plump Hill


Ancestry

MOORE

Benja - 27 Haulier Coal, all born Glos East Dean
Elizabeth - 26
Levenia - 5 (GRO Index, Lavenia MOORE - mother's maiden name PHELPS)
Jane - 4
William - 1
Mary Ann - 2 months


The Gloucestershire Genelogical Database

has 3 baptisms of Non-conformist parents: Benjamin MOORE of East Dean, Plump Hill (and Elizabeth)

William - 5 August 1849
Mary Ann - 23 Mar 1851
Thomas - 26 Sept 1852


Family Search has


Marriage, at Ross, Herefordshire, Oct-Nov-Dec Qtr 1845

Benjamin MOOR and Elizabeth PHELPS.


-----


Seems, Benjamin was transporting coal up and down the River Severn and this branch of the family were non-conformists!


---

Gloucestershire, England Electoral Registers 1832-1974

1843 and 1844

Christian Name and Surname of each Voter at full length :MOORE Benjamin

Place of Abode: Westbury Brook, Plump Hill

Nature of Qualification: Freehold houses and land

Street Name etc: Westbury Brook - self and others.

(this property etc could be on old maps)


----

Outside chance the surname MOORE/MOOR was an alias or illegitimate

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 16:36 (184 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

It may be the 'money' came from the BRIGHT family.

Herefordshire, 1851 census.
Weston Under Penyard

Bill Mill House

BRIGHT

Thomas - Head, married, aged 66, Farmer of 130 acres 4 labourer, born Taynton, Glos ** c1785
Mary - wife - 55 - born Westbury
Mary - 29 - born Westbury
Elizabeth - dau - unmarried - 27 - born Walford, Hereford
Louisa - dau - unmarried - 26 - born ditto
Esther - daughter - unmarried - 24 - born ditto


** Thomas BRIGHT, christened at Taynton, 16 June 1785, parents: Thomas & Elizabeth


22 June 1784
Thomas BRIGHT of Tainton, married Elizabeth SMITH - at Tainton
witnesses: Sarah BRIGHT and Thomas HOOK


----

Licence:

12 April 1760

James BRIGHT - aged 22, Batchelor, Yeoman, residence: Longhope
Jane SANSUM - aged 21, Spinster, residence: Longhope

---

Apart from the 4 daughters, James & Jane BRIGHT had a son buried 29 August 1769 at Longhope

---

If you Google:

Herefordshire Wills on line


and the herefordshire.gov.uk website

Wills Search | Wills search | Herefordshire Council


Lots of Bright Wills - with some useful information .
----

James BRIGHT burial at Longhope - 5 September 1782

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 16:54 (184 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Ancestry

Gloucestershire, England, Land Tax Records

1713-1833

Ancestry transcribed as

James BRIGHT
Residence Year: 1777
Residence Place: LONGHAM, Gloucestershire
Hundred: Duchy of Lancaster

/..... Inhabitants of Longhope etc.

James BRIGHT for part of late Sansome's 13s 4d.


There's a few others, lised as James BRIGHT, other J BRIGHT ETC.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 17:59 (184 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

I always struggle to do 'links'

However, there is a previous thread - by EandKA (no envelope next to name) dated and headed

2 September 2005 and heading

MOTTLEY (Ruardean) and BRIGHT (Longhope)

and includes the following inscriptions on the Longhope Village Website-All Saints' Churchyard

'Here Lieth the body of Sarah the wife of Josiah BRIGHT, of the parish of Taynton, and daughter of James and Mary MOTTLEY, of the Parish of Ruardeane, who died February 16th 1773 - aged 37

'Also in memory of Josiah BRIGHT, husband of the afore-said, who died March the 16th 1777 aged 52 years.

etc etc.

There are about 6 various BRIGHT groups listed graves/and memorials on the Longhope Village Website - and mentions BRIGHT's from Ross etc.


---

Josiah BRIGHT's Will mentions his two brothers, Thomas & James BRIGHT etc. Very clear Will to read, with lots of family names.


Josiah BRIGHT married Sarah MOTTLEY 30 Octoer 1759 at Ruardean

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Wednesday, March 25, 2020, 05:31 (182 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thank you so much for all the information. I suspected that maybe his money may have come from the Bright family. So far as I can gather Jane Bright's father James Bright (who may have been the one that died in Longhope like you pointed out)was born about 1738. I can't find a definite baptism for him, and his burial record doesn't record an age. His marriage transcription aged him as 22 years, but I wonder how good the handwriting was being transcribed and could it have been a 32 years??? If that was so then the baptism of a James Bright in 1727 to Thomas and Joan Bright may be right. However without seeing the original it could also be correct as 22 years. I would love to prove the link between my James and the Longhope Brights as I am sure they are related and they do all seem to have a bit of money (certainly to afford tombstones in those times also).

At any rate, it makes sense that Benjamin Moore's money came from his wife Jane Bright's family. It certainly is good that he made good use for it for his family. Thank you so much for translating words from the Benjamin's will for me - ie Cider Mill House and Press and Bake House. I struggled with the word "Cider" and couldn't figure out what sort of mill it was. I love the idea that they obviously must have had an apple orchard then and made their own booze haha. There must have been a lot of apple pies etc cooked by Jane, and I can see the kids getting into the orchard eating apples.
Thank you again for all your research, it has been a huge help.

Belinda.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Wednesday, March 25, 2020, 08:30 (182 days ago) @ BelindaHill

Had a quick look - (these BRIGHT's seem to own a lot of land)


The Marriage Bond for James BRIGHT - 12 April 1760 to Jane SANSUM

Witness 1 : Josiah BRIGHT a Yeoman of Longhope

(witnesses: Robert HOOPER and William GRINDON)


----

Josiah BRIGHT, Yeoman of Longhope (also married by Licence & Bond)

29 Otober 1759

to Sarah MOTTLEY

Witness 1: Thomas BRIGHT a Yeoman of HUNTLEY

On the actual marriage of Joseph BRIGHT to Sarah MOTLEY - witnesses: William GRINDON and Thomas SUFFE

---

Then you have, Marriage Licence for James MOTTLEY of Ruardean, yeoman and Mary BRIGHT of Longhope : 1759

---

Farmers making sure sons/daughters marry into farming families etc. (so land is kept in families etc)

---

Checking all the BRIGHT marriage by Licence could help form family groups...


---


Bristory History on Line

Longhope | British History Olnline

The farmer Thomas BRIGHT, one of the resident manorial baliffs in the mid 17th century, was reputed to be well over 110 years old at his death in 1708.


--

If you use the Advance Search for witness' names - this always yields clues (The availability to search for witnesses is a very useful tool)

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Wednesday, March 25, 2020, 08:59 (182 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

I realised the Land Tax Record for

James BRIGHT for part of the late SANSOME's - refers to Jane SANSUM's family

--

and underneath James BRIGHT

Thos JONES for part of ditto (ie. late Sansome) 13s. 4d ***
Widdow BLEWETT fore part of ditto (ie. late Sansome) - 12s.00

Just started looking at the Wills for SANSUM - Longhope -

Mary SANSUM 1766 of Longhopew - mentions her lawful and natural sistrer Ann DOBBS

as some of the earlier Wills surnames aree spelt SANSOME/SANSOM/SAUNSOM etc.


***

Marriage at Longhope 25 September 1766

Thomas JONES, batchelor of Ross, Margaret SANSUM - Spinster of Longhope, by Licence


There are two copies of the Licence and Bond on the records

One record, lists Margaret as SANSOM, aged 22, Spinster of Longhope
and the other as Margaret SANSUM

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Saturday, March 28, 2020, 05:28 (179 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thank you so much for the information. I really appreciate it. It has given me much to think about and work on.

abenhall baptisms

by MPGriffiths @, Saturday, March 28, 2020, 10:36 (179 days ago) @ BelindaHill

Jane BRIGHT on her marriage licence 1788 was living at Gutheridge, (ancient name for GOODRICH) Herefordshire - but marries in Abenhall

-----

James BRIGHT, her father dies in 1782 - no Will anywhere??


----


The only other MOORE at Abenhall, was the marriage of

Mary MOORE - 1 July 1804 (residence, Hundred of St Briavels) to Joseph MARSHALL (residence, Hundred of St Briavels)

witness: Jph JORDAN and John HALE


Benjamin MOORE, has only 4 children .... and Mary would be c1884 approx

---

? There are two burials of a Joseph MARSHALL at English Bicknore, 1807 and 1810

as

Mary MARSHALL, Widow, Hundred of St Briavels,
marries

John JONES - Bachelor, 26 February 1815

witnesses: Martha POWEEL and Rich(ar)d LOWE

with consent of friends

----

JONES .....

?

Baptism at Arlingham, 13 December 1818

John Jones JONES - parents: John (Merchant) and Mary

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Wednesday, April 01, 2020, 03:22 (176 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thank you, that has given me much to work on.

abenhall baptisms

by BelindaHill @, Monday, March 23, 2020, 05:54 (184 days ago) @ MPGriffiths

Thank you so much for the information. I have traced what happened to him from marriage to Jane Bright, their children, grandchildren, etc down the line. I have his will on ancestry and he does seem to be wealthy. But nothing of the records helps with finding where he was born exactly and to whom, though I wonder if maybe his father may have been a John?? as his only son was named this. I simply can't find a baptism of any description anywhere. 1841 census claimed he was born in Gloucestershire, and marriage record and marriage allegation claimed he was living in Abenhall. But really, who knows where he was from.

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