Good day all

I have a Phoebe Marfell married to John Prosser living in Monmouthshire in 1841. Phoebe states she is born in Monmouthshire but I can't find her birth there. I know there are a lot of Marfells to be found in Forest of Dean. Phoebe is supposedly born around 1813 and I'm wondering if any of the group are following this family and have Phoebe in their tree or can point me in the right direction.

Many thanks,

Jane Hope

Hi Jane,
please can you give us more information, ideally the whole 1841 Census household you have, or at least a more-specific location ? I ask as I've tried to find your household on FamilySearch and have found a few possibles, the most likely being in Upper Llanover, Blaenavon, so a fair distance (20miles?) west of Monmouth, on the western edge of the Forest. As you say, the Marfell and Prosser names are not unusual in the area so as much info as possible will best help us to try and help you.
Do you have any poarticular reason for thinking Phoebe is a Forester ?
I have searched this forum for related old threads but so far have found nothing, nor the marriage record.

In theory, anyone born in the Forest of Dean "should" be shown in the records as born in "Gloucestershire", altho to be fair this has often been something of a grey area especially considering the western Forest which was governed from Monmouth town.

Thanks, J.

As you may be aware her birthplace is variously given on GR (and probably other sites as well) as,

1851 Phoobe PRESSER, Llanover, Mon, aged 38 (1813)

1861 Phoebe PROSSER, Blaenavon, Mon, aged 51 (1810)

1871 Phoebe PROSSER, Widow, Blaenavon, Mon, aged 62 (1809)

If you have access there are several trees on Ancestry which seem to include her. Unfortunately they have clearly copied their information from each other. The only one with a source is labelled NEWFTW~01. The source information says only,

Birth
ABT 1809 Blaenavon, Monmouthshire, Wales

Source Information
Title
Records of Parish Church of St. Peter, Blaenavon, Monmouthshire, Wales

Repository Information
No repository specified for this source.

The tree claims her father to be Joseph Marfwyld MARFELL and Mary (unknown). Other trees give her mother as Mary PARKER but quote no source. Personally I would not take this information as gospel.

They seem to have spent their life in Llanover where John was a shoemaker.

Hi Jeff and Mike

I have Phoebe with John Prosser on the 1841 census and 1851 census living in Monmouthshire. I plumped for FoD because I'm a member of Mongenes and when I do a search I often search on both sites as they are in close proximity. FoD seems to have alot of Marfells on its books so to speak. I believe it to be Phoebe Marfell as that surname is the one on the GRO index attached to George born abt. 1840 - he's the only one that fits.

I saw the listing for Phoebe's father being a Joseph and the mother being Mary Parker on the Latter Day Saints site - like you, I'm sceptical.

Funnily enough, there is an Elizabeth Marfell living next door to a William Prosser and his wife Lydia in Minersville, Schuylkilll County, Pennsylvania in 1880 - which I think belong to the same family (John Prosser and Phoebe's youngest daughter called Lydia)

Ofcourse I may be barking up the wrong tree. Seems strange that I can't seem to find a marriage or a birth for Phoebe.

Many thanks for any light you can shed on this.

Jane

? very faint (print out)

1841 Census on Ancestry -
Monmouthshire, Wales, Llanover Upper

Page 15 (second section)

John ESPOPER - 30 (Cordwainer's above, inc Henry Hill and John is 'ditto')
Phoebe ESPOPER - 30
Willm ESPOPER - 12
Elz PROPER - 7
Mary ESPOPER - 6
John PROPER - 3
George PROPER - 1

There is also, Thos POSSELL 1791 and Elizabeth POSSELL 1821, Eugal POSSELL 1826 on the same page.

There seems to be an Elizth MARFELL aged 25 with a few others on the next page - but it's so faint needs a bit more 'delving'

+ Mary MARFELL - 20
Rebecca MARFELL - 15
Lidia (?) MARFELL - 14

Mary MARFELL etc on Ancestry on the next page to John ESPOPER (PROSSER)

Llanover Upper, Monmouthshire District 8 - 1841 census

John MOPIN - c 1821, (possibly PROSSER)

Elizth SIMPER c 1816, Dressmaker born in County
Mary SIMPER c 1821
Rebecca SIMPER - c 1826
Ledia SIMPEER c 1827
Mary LANDON - 1836
Elisha NESSTEWS - 1806 (could be MATTHEWS)

etc etc

Hi

Thanks for the info re the census. I have the family on the census but am trying to track back - I can't find a birth or marriage for Phoebe. The Prosser family is prolific in both Monmouthshire and Forest of Dean so, I was hoping, as I can't seem to find a birth in the Monmouthshire district Phoebe Marfell and John Prosser might have married in the Forest of Dean, and thereby finding her birth. Not having much luck so far.

Many thanks.

Jane

Jim Ashton is a "local" expert on the Marfell family.
If he doesn't pick up your post directly you could contact him through the email icon next to his name in any "Marfell" post to which he has contributed.

I have 3 Phobe Marfell's in my tree but none seem to match!

Regards

Colin

Without knowing what information you have, it is difficult to know whether to add any more information.

Back to previous reply regarding the SIMPER (Marfell) family on the following 1841 census page.....

This tree is on Ancestry

and on the 1851 census,

Church Road Lllanover, is

Elizabeth MARFELL - unmarried aged 37, Dressmaker, born Lllanover
Lydia MARFELL - sister 25

and tree(s) on Ancestry gives

Lydia MARFELL birth 19 December 1826 - Monmouthshire Wales, parents: Joseph MARFELL and Mary PARKER

Lydia DANDO (appears to be a family name) died 1879 Minersville, Schuylkil, Pennsylvania (buried in the Methodist Cemetery)

Rebecca on the 1841 census, died 17 July 1845, Abergavenny, Monmouthsire,

??? Non-conformists.....

etc etc

Thanks for the help and suggestions. I'm extremely grateful.

Jane

It took a bit of finding but I wonder if this is Phoebe from FamilySearch,

Name Foebe Marfield
Event Type Baptism
Event Date 31 Jul 1808
Event Place Llanover, Monmouthshire, Wales

The image should be available on Findmypast.

From the image:
Llanover Baptism
31 July 1808 Foebe Daughter of Joseph Marfield, Shoemaker and Mary
(The transcription on Family Search is accurate)

There is a further entry as follows:
14 October 1810 Anne Daughter of Joseph Marfell, Shoemaker, and Mary

Mike

A search of the index produces the following baptisms:
First name(s) Last name Birth year Baptism year Father's first name(s) Mother's first name(s) Place

Foebe Marfield 1808 1808 Joseph Mary Llanover

Anne Marfield 1810 1810 Joseph Mary Llanover (transcription error - should be Marfell)

Elizabeth Marfell 1813 1813 Joseph Mary Llanover

George Marfell 1816 1816 Joseph Mary Llanover

Mary Marfell 1819 1819 Joseph Mary Llanover

Rebecca Marfell 1823 1823 Joseph Mary Llanover

Lydia Marfell 1826 1826 Joseph Mary Llanover

Also the following Marriage:
First name(s) Joseph
Last name Marfield (transcribed correctly)
Year 1807
Event Marriage
Marriage year 1807
Marriage date 14 Jun 1807
Residence Llanover
Place Llanover
County Monmouthshire
Country Wales
Spouse's first name(s) Mary
Spouse's last name Parker
Spouse's residence Llanover
Record set Monmouthshire Marriages And Banns

The marriage was by Licence.

This would appear to be Joseph's burial:
Name Joseph Marfell
Event Type Burial
Event Date 25 Mar 1837
Event Place Llanover, Monmouthshire, Wales
Age 62
Birth Year (Estimated) 1775

Could this be Joseph's Baptism:

Year: 1776
Month: Feb
Day: 25
Parents_Surname: MARFILL
Child_Forenames: Joseph
Fathers_Forenames: Richard
Mothers_Forenames: Mary
Mothers_Surname:
Residence:
Occupation:
Officiating_Minister: John COPNER
Event: Baptism
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P275 IN 1/5
Page_Number: 39
Parish_Chapel: Ruardean

Mike

Marriage for Phoebe:
First name(s) John
Last name Prosser
Year 1828
Event Marriage
Marriage year 1828
Marriage date 06 Apr 1828
Residence Llanover
Place Llanover
County Monmouthshire
Country Wales
Spouse's first name(s) Phoebe (original is Phebe)
Spouse's last name Morfell
Spouse's residence Llanover
Record set Monmouthshire Marriages And Banns
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Marriages & divorces

Source: Find My Past.

Looking at the original the Surname looks like Morfell but Phebe appears to have signed Marfell.

Mike

Mike

I'm absolutely thrilled, you've come up trumps for me with this family. I'm extremely grateful.

Jane

Again, many thanks, Mike. This joins the dots on the John Prosser I had with Phoebe Marfell.

I'm most grateful.

Jane

Hi Jane

I have just spotted your enquiry regarding Phoebe Marfell. My main interest is the Marfell Family. I have 9 Phoebe Marfell's in my tree, but none match the date of your original search.

Going through the thread, there is mention of a Phoebe Marfell 1809, daughter of Joseph Marfell 1776(my GGGG Uncle) and Mary Parker.

Phoebe is my 1st cousin 4 times removed.

If this is the Phoebe you are researching, I would be pleased to hear from you, if you click on the envelope, you can send an email. I may be able to assist you further, I have for instance got a copy of Mary Marfell nee Parker's death certificate which I could copy to you. On the certificate it mentions that Elizabeth Marfell was in attendance at Mary's death, this would be Phoebe's sister Elizabeth who emigrated to USA following the death of their sister Lydia, in order for Elizabeth to look after Lydia's 5 children.

Phoebe has 6 siblings that I know of, I do not however have any information about her marriage, so we could perhaps share information. I have already learned the date of her father Josephs date of death from the thread. I also previously was aware of his marriage date but not where, so that too is information gained.

Jim Ashton