St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families (General)
by Paulina, Saturday, April 07, 2018, 08:34 (2415 days ago)
Hi All,
Just looking for a steer. I recently joined ancestry.com and discovered my entire matriarchal line from my Grandmother (Victoria Lewis) all the way back as far as I could research (about 1750) were all born, married and died in or near St Briavels. A great revelation and now of course I wish to go there soon. In fact, my ill fated fourth great grandmother Mary Whittington actually sadly drowned in the river Wye (cause unknown, the inquest says she walked out into the snow) and thereafter it seems that my fourth great grandmother on the other side, who lived at The Fence married her widower. Her name was Hannah Bromley. The previously born children of the both great grandmothers thereafter married and one of their children was my grandmothers grandmother, Maryanne Whittington.
I'd only imagine the gossip back there in the day and I'm greatly intrigued by this story.
Does anyone know anything about this?
regards
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by MPGriffiths , Saturday, April 07, 2018, 11:48 (2415 days ago) @ Paulina
Previous thread on Gloucester Inquests (2008)
1814
April
On the 14th at Tintern Parva, on the body of Mary WHITTINGTON a poor woman who was lost during the snow, on the night of 15th January last at Redbrook. Found drowned in the River Wye: Verdict: Accidental Death from suffociation and drowning.
(Mary Whttington, aged 48, buried 25 March 1814) Redbrook - burial at Newland
(wife of William)
---
On the net and googling for Winter 1814 - says it was a Cold Year with a severe Winter. Probably the snowiest Winters for 300 years!!
The History of British Winters netweather.tv says:
1813-1814 was one of the coldest Winters in the CET Series
(London had 'thick' fog) - The Forest may have also!)
----
1947 was the Snowiest Winter since January 1814
15 January 1814 was a Saturday
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Paulina, Sunday, April 08, 2018, 22:13 (2414 days ago) @ MPGriffiths
Thanks! Interesting.
I wondered whether there would have been terrible scandal when my other great grandmother upped and married my great grandmother Mary's husband?
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Paulina, Sunday, April 08, 2018, 22:22 (2414 days ago) @ MPGriffiths
Wow! Poor woman. Could she have killed herself? Why would she go out in that weather?
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Mike Pinchin , Bedford, England, Sunday, April 08, 2018, 13:14 (2414 days ago) @ Paulina
Maybe this article has some useful information in it,
BNA Gloucester Journal - Saturday 11 August 1855
BROMLEY v PLUMMER AND ANOTHER.—An Action of Ejectment. —Mr. Whitmore, Q.C. and Mr. Powell were for the plaintiff; Mr. Keating, QC and Mr. Gray for the defendants. Both the plaintiff and defendants in this case are in humble circumstances, and the matter in dispute was as to the right to a cottage and two acres of land, at a place called the Fence, in the Forest of Dean. This property formerly belonged to Henry Bromley, an old man, who died in 1813. He was twice married. By his first wife he had two sons, who having enlisted as soldiers, went abroad at the beginning of the present century, and were never more heard of. Old Bromley, by his second wife, also had a family, whose eldest son, Thomas, was the father of the present claimant. The defendant was the uncle, being the second son of old Bromley. Thomas, who also left this country, returned in 1827, resided on the property some time, and left in 1836, when he married. He died 1838, having allowed his mother to reside upon the property. His son, the present claimant, was horn in 1832, and had now arrived at a sufficient age to claim as heir at law. Several witnesses, both for the plaintiff and the defendant, were examined, and Mr. Keating, for the defendant, contended that he had more than forty years’ uninterrupted adverse possession, entitling him by law to become the legal owner of the property, the principal value of which, in fact, he had created by the erection of a house upon it, or at any rate had greatly increased its value. His Lordship, in summing up, said the question for the jury was, whether Thomas, when he returned, actually took possession of the property as its owner. If the action had been brought three or four years ago, it seemed to his lordship, there would have been no answer to it ; but since then the 40 years had elapsed. If, however, the jury considered Thomas did not disturb the possession of his mother, they must bring in a verdict for the defendant; if they thought otherwise—that he took possession as owner, they must find for the plaintiff.—The jury, after a brief consultation, found a verdict for the plaintiff.
Bromley/Brombley St Briavels
by MPGriffiths , Sunday, April 08, 2018, 16:54 (2414 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin
National Archives, Kew
Reference: WO 97/23/37
Thomas BROMBLEY alias Thomas BROMLEY born St Briavels, Gloucestershire Served in 3rd Dragoons
Discharged aged 30
Date: 1814-1827
Held at The National Archives, Kew
(availale to download from FindmyPast)
---
Thomas BROMLEY christened at St Briavels, 27 March 1796, parents: Henry & Hannah
William BROMLEY christened at St Briavels, 14 March 1802, parents: Henry & Hannah ***
Tree on Ancestry, says William BROMLEY married Esther PROSSER ** 16 September 1826 and gives 1851 census in Newland
Forest of Dean transcript says: William BROMLEY married Esther PROSSER (Widow) at Newland:
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Marriage at St Briavels
22 April 1830
Thomas BROMBLEY (Bachelor) Hundred of St Briavels
Charlotte TOWNSEND - Hundred of St Briavels
by banns
witnesses: William & Hester BROMBLEY
---
Can see on the Forest of Dean records 1841 census for Brockweir Common
BROMLEY
Charlotte - 30
Thomas - 5
Henry - 7
Ancestry at the moment won't call this family 'up'
--
and Charlotte BROMLEY (Spinster) father: Richard TOWNSEND a Mason
married John WATTS, Widower, 11 August 1846 at Newland.
1851 Census, Newland
Inward?
Ancestry transcribed as BATTS
John - 40
Charlott BATTS - 40 born Tidenham, Herefordshire
Thomas BROMLEY - 16
William WATTS - 9
===
1861 Census Newland
address: Private
BROMLEY
Thomas - 26, Stone Cutter, born Hewlesfield
Charlotte - 26 born St Briavels
Mary Jane - 2
Richard TOWNSEND, Lodger, 82, Invalid, born Clearwell
Bromley/Brombley St Briavels
by Paulina, Sunday, April 08, 2018, 22:20 (2414 days ago) @ MPGriffiths
My head's spinning I can't keep the pieces all together.
Thank you so much for this!
I had no idea I was so connected into the Forest. My Grandmother was born in Lydney in 1901 and she always said we were from the Forest of Dean, but no one took her up on it. Now I'm regretful about this.
I would very much like to visit. It looks like many many generations of my maternal forebears come from St Briavels. How amazing.
Bromley/Brombley St Briavels
by Paulina, Monday, April 09, 2018, 01:37 (2414 days ago) @ MPGriffiths
Thanks for your amazing replies.
I just checked the family tree. Henry and Hannah Bromley had a daughter Mary as well as the two sons. Mary Bromley is my third great grandmother.
Here is what I know of her:
Mary Bromley
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 27 May 1798 St Briavels
She married William Whittington (whose mother drowned in the river Wye) in Newland in 1816.
It looks like the brothers fought over the land.
regards and thanks for your help!
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Paulina, Sunday, April 08, 2018, 22:11 (2414 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin
Yes, this is them! Thanks so much!
Gosh the family were at war. How fascinating a story.
Where can I find out more about them. Is there any way to find out where the property was or to read the law report?
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by jhopkins , Monday, April 09, 2018, 05:05 (2414 days ago) @ Paulina
Paulina - this is a fascinating journey!
Just a wee warning though - we live in New Zealand, and our only visit to the Forest was based upon a misunderstanding and this meant I did not make the most of that single opportunity.
I failed to appreciate the difference between a village and a parish, so that when we went looking for places where my relatives had lived and been born/died, at times I was wrongly looking at a village assuming that was where they lived. In fact they had been baptised or buried in a parish of the same name, not in the village, and it was only on return to NZ (too late!) that I discovered my mistake(s).
I hope this is not teaching a grandmother to suck eggses...
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Paulina, Monday, April 09, 2018, 10:41 (2413 days ago) @ jhopkins
Thanks for this!
I will bear your advice in mind. I live in New Zealand too. The Forest area seems quite compact. My grandmother and her sisters and brothers were all born in Aylburton but have since left many many years ago. I suppose a couple of weeks in the area would be good?
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by jhopkins , Thursday, April 12, 2018, 23:55 (2410 days ago) @ Paulina
Hi Paulina
You are certainly right about the Forest being compact. For a fellow Kiwi, this may give some sense of scale:
Land area of Wales: 20,735 km²
Land area of the province of Canterbury, NZ: 45,346 km²
Land area of the Forest of Dean: 526.4 km²
So Canterbury is more than twice the size of the whole country of Wales, and the Forest is a fraction of the size of Wales.
My ancestors once lived in Aylburton as well. There is a beautiful road up a ridge from Aylburton to the village of St Briavels; we encountered a traffic jam of pheasants on that road. Wherever your ancestors came from, visit the area around St Briavels Castle - the views towards Wales are lovely.
My great grandparents emigrated to Saltwater Creek, North Canterbury in 1860, and were followed by a number of siblings in the following years.
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by Mike Pinchin , Bedford, England, Monday, April 09, 2018, 20:13 (2413 days ago) @ Paulina
One way of looking for a location is to search old newspapers. There are several mentions of The Fence, near St Briavels, in the British Newspaper Archive (a subscription site – although it can be free-searched for the basic details) but none give a definitive idea.
Another way is to search old maps. This map, from the National Library of Scotland, shows a place called The Fence about a mile north-west of St Briavels. Look in the bottom left hand corner just to the right of Slip Wood. St Briavels is on the next map south.
http://maps.nls.uk/view/101453649
The name has survived to this day since putting it into Streetmap will also find it.
I don’t think there are any on-line records of UK civil actions. However, this link to the UK National Archives might be helpful.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/civil-litiga...
St Briavels - Lewis/ Whittington / Bromley / Jones families
by rsligi , Thursday, April 19, 2018, 20:49 (2403 days ago) @ Mike Pinchin
The Fence St B> actually its in the hamlet of Mork just down the hill from the church. Nearly all my Mothers family past , Williams, lived in The Fence and you can still walk/drive the narrow lane. Most of the few houses there are built on/over or extensions of the old homes but I failed to find anyone who new much of the past. Most of the homes were tied to Lindors, the mansion which is now a religious holiday place but will do teas on the terrace if you just walk in and I recommend you do this as they sell a booklet of the history of Lindors which mentions many of the workers by name.