Forest of Dean FHT Forum - Cinderford Male Voice Choir, general history notes.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir, general history notes. (reply)

Jefff — Mon, 16 Oct 2017 22:19:24 +0000

"As in other coalfields in the 19th century, workingclass culture flowered with the formation of brass bands, choral societies, and football clubs, some of which survived in 1993. In the mid 19th century club anniversaries and school treats were often marked by parades and religious services. Until the mid 1850s those events were usually attended by musicians from neighbouring places such as Blakeney, Littledean, Mitcheldean, and Ross-on-Wye (Herefs.). Marching bands later proliferated within the Forest and local band contests became important events. In 1864 a commentator noted that, like miners elsewhere, Foresters had excellent voices and enjoyed music. The later burgeoning of chapel choirs and of local choral competitions led to the formation of choral societies and male voice choirs. One annual competition, the Forest of Dean Eisteddfod started in 1897, was usually held at Double View school in Cinderford. Cinderford had a new choral society in 1898 and a male voice choir in 1912, and Ruspidge a choral society in 1892."

Nearby Drybrook and Ruardean also had choirs, as did other Dean villages of course, see
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/glos/vol5/pp381-389

As an example of just one of Cinderford's Churches, "our" family church St Stephens had an impressively-sized choir when this photo was taken c1908, about the same time as the Male Voice Choir with which it presumably shared some members. When I attended St Stephens every Sunday as a child in the late 60s and early 70s, the choir then was always about a dozen strong.
https://www.sungreen.co.uk/Cinderford-Glos/st_stephens_choir.html

"Cinderford's well-known GP Dr M L Bangara was President of the Male Voice Choir.
He was born at Mangalore in South India in 1881, the son of a district and sessions judge. After qualifying as a doctor at Edinburgh University he moved to Cinderford in 1915, working in his own practice and at the Dilke Memorial Hospital. In addition to his work as a doctor, he was an active member of the community and a leading light in a variety of local organisations including the Freemasons, Cinderford Horticultural Society, Dickens Fellowship, Excelsior Band and the Cinderford Male Voice Choir. Dr Bangara died of complications following influenze shortly after his 46th birthday in April 1927."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/gloucestershire/untold_stories/asian/bangara_nanda.shtml
http://www.forest-of-dean.net/downloads/Stories_Articles/Dr_M_L_Bangara_Cinderford.pdf

The local Co-operative Society also had choirs, according to this excellent history booklet.
https://www.midcounties.coop/pdf/heritage/Oxford-Swindon-and-Gloucester/2002-The-Forest...

Cinderford's Mr Alfred KEAR, Mayor of Hereford. (reply)

ACP — Sun, 15 Oct 2017 19:27:36 +0000

Thank you to everybody for so much information about Cinderford Male Voice Choir. I do believe they were pretty good. Unfortunately I missed some recordings in an online auction from the 1940's/50's; they had already been sold. I think the choir disbanded in the 1950's but I don't know why.
Thanks again, ACP

Cinderford's Mr Alfred KEAR, Mayor of Hereford. (reply)

Jefff — Sun, 15 Oct 2017 00:47:34 +0000

Searching tinternet for Alfred Kear in Hereford found this detailed history of cycling in the city, including the formation of the Hereford Wheelers Cycling Club in 1928, the club still exists under that name with about 200 members.

"By this time Frank Shubert had approached the Mayor of Hereford, Alderman Alfred Kear, for support. He knew the mayor’s interests included the promotion of outdoor exercise – particularly cycling –among the youth of the town and was not disappointed. Alfred Kear allowed the inaugural meeting of the club to be held in the Town Hall, defraying all costs and taking on the responsibility of chairman himself. ..."
http://www.herefordwheelers.com/History/Hereford%20Wheelers%20History.pdf

The above link includes a great photo of 3 cyclists from c1895 at "Hereford Football Ground", Edgar Street, with Coningsby Hospital(Widemarsh Street) in the background. This is the earliest photo I've ever seen of sports on the ground of the footie team I've supported since 1970s childhood, which originally had a running (and cycling?) track around the pitch. The 1902 O.S. map confirms it's location.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=853192214861858&set=p.853192214861858&t...

----

The London Gazette of 1903 carried a notice of the business partnership between Alfred Kear and Walter Griffiths Clutterbuck being dissolved, wrt their shops in Hereford and Commercial St Cinderford, all debts to be paid by Kear. I think this means Alfred is buying Walter out of the business.
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/27514/page/190/data.pdf

----

The Gloucester Journal of 26 November 1938 carried a photo of the elderly Kear family;
"76 IS THEIR AVERAGE AGE
Top, left right, Mr. William James Kear, Otford, Kent; Mr. George Kear, Cinderford; seated, Mrs. Alfred Hale, Cinderford; Mr. Alfred Kear, a former Mayor 0f Hereford, and Miss Florence Kear, Cinderford. They met recently for a family... "
http://www.genesreunited.co.nz/searchbna/results?memberlastsubclass=none&searchhist...

UPDATE: Thanks to fellow Hereford FC fan Diane Carpenter for this image of the photo, as well as the cyclists one earlier.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=853440101503736&set=p.853440101503736&t...

Alfred Kear was indeed Mayor of Hereford in 1923.
http://www.herefordcitycouncil.gov.uk/past-mayors/

----

Finally, from 2012;
"A HEREFORDSHIRE councillor and the owner of one of Herefordshire’s most well-known independent shops has died aged 82. Gordon Lucas, a Conservative town and county councillor and former Ross-on-Wye mayor, ran Lucas Motorcycles in Ross for 50 years having started his career in the motor industry at Alfred Kear’s shop in Hereford."
http://www.ledburyreporter.co.uk/news/10051247.Tributes_to_former_mayor_and_county_coun...

Cinderford shopkeeper c1902, Mr Alfred KEAR (reply)

Jefff — Sat, 14 Oct 2017 18:49:05 +0000

The Kelly's Trade Directory of Cinderford 1902 edition also lists them, as follows,

CINDERFORD

Commercial:

KEAR Alfred & Co., sewing machine & cycle agents

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cbennett/cinderford1902.htm

----

I guess Alfred Kear is probably a relative of the others, but struggling to find him for sure. This seemed a likely fit, recruits for the Machine Gun Regiments needed good mechanical aptitude & handskills, exactly as per sewing machines & cycles, but this man seems to be too young to have been a shopkeeper in 1902, altho his Army age seems odd.. ?

Name Alfred Henry Kear
Event Type Military Service
Event Year 1915
Residence Place Drybrook, Gloucestershire, England
Age 29
Military Company/Regiment Guards Machine Gun Regiment
Military Regiment 2720
Birth Year (Estimated) 1886
Birthplace , Gloucestershire, England

1911 West Dean, Glos.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Alfred Kear Head M 46 COAL MINER AT FACE OF COAL. Bream, Gloucestershire
Harriet Kear Wife F 45 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Alfred Henry Kear Son M 18 SHOP ASSISTANCE. Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Elizabeth Kear Daughter F 14 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Mildred Blanch Kear Daughter F 11 Bream, Gloucestershire
Clifford John Kear Son M 8 Bream, Gloucestershire

1901 Breams Woodside, West Dean(Gloucs), Monmouthshire, England.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Alfred Kear Head M 36 COAL MINER HEWER. Bream, Gloucestershire
Harriet Kear Wife F 35 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Alfred H Kear Son M 8 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Lilian Kear Daughter F 6 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Elizabeth Kear Daughter F 4 Whitecroft, Gloucestershire
Mildred B Kear Daughter F 1 Bream, Gloucestershire

Record_ID: 145100
Entry_Number:
Year: 1892
Month: Nov
Day: 24
Parents_Surname: KEAR
Child_Forenames: Alfred Henry
Fathers_Forenames: Alfred
Mothers_Forenames: Harriet
Mothers_Surname:
Residence: Whitecroft
Occupation: Collier
Officiating_Minister: Isaac Brentnall
Event: Baptism
Memoranda: Born Oct[ober] 8/92
Notes:
Register_Reference: D2598/4/2
Page_Number: 42
Parish_Chapel: Lydney Primitive Methodist
Soundex: K600

1891 Chapel Hill, St Pauls Parish, West Dean, Monmouthshire.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Alfred Kear Head M 26 Coal miner. Newland, Gloucestershire, England
Harriet Kear Wife F 25 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England

Pleased to see he survived WW1, the Machine Gunners were considered to be suicide squads !

Record_ID: 1009467
Entry_Number: 1501
Year: 1961
Month: Jan
Day: 19
Surname: KEAR
Forenames: Alfred Henry
Residence: Morse Road Drybrook
Age_at_death: 69
Officiating_Minister: J Bernard Smith Vicar
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P109 IN 1/38
Page_No: 188
Parish_Chapel: Drybrook
Soundex: K600

-----------

So if this isn't our shopkeeper in 1902, who is ???

I am a fool !!, it's probably George's older brother, as posted earlier !

1871 East Dean, Glos.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
James Kear Head M 38 Grocer. Yorkley, Gloucestershire
Amelia Kear Wife F 40 Grocer Wife. Little Dean Hills, Gloucestershire
Florance Kear Daughter F 13 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Alfred Kear Son M 11 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
George Kear Son M 8 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
William Kear Son M 3 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Anne Kear Daughter F 0 Cinderford, Gloucestershire

Which gives;

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Dec 1885 (>99%)
Kear Alfred Northampton 3b 192
Holt Catherine Ridgway Northampton 3b 192

1891 Ryelands Street, Hereford St Nicholas, Herefordshire.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Albert Kear Head M 31 Sub Manager For Singer M C Mfc Co. Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Catherine R Kear Wife F 27 Northamptonshire, England
Evelyn A Kear Daughter F 4 Glamorganshire, England
Gordon J Kear Son M 2 Glamorganshire, England
Florence R Kear Daughter F 0 Herefordshire, England
Mary E Nelmes Servant F 18 Gloucestershire, England

1901 Commercial St, Hereford St Peter, Herefordshire, Wales.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Alfred Kear Head M 41 CYCLE & MUSICAL INSTRUMENT DEALER SHOPKEEPER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Catherine R Kear Wife F 37 Northampton
Gordon J Kear Son M 12 Cardiff, Glamorganshire
Florence R Kear Daughter F 10 Hereford
Percival A Kear Son M 6 Hereford
Walter G Clutterbuck Partner M 60 Gloucester, Gloucestershire

1911 Hereford City, St Nicholas, Hereford, Herefordshire, England.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Alfred Kear Head M 51 CYCLE AND MOTOR AGENT DEALER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Catherine Redgway Kear Wife F 47 Northampton, Northamptonshire
Evelyn Amelia Kear Daughter F 24 TEACHER COUNTY COUNCIL. Cardiff, Glamorganshire
Florence Redgway Kear Daughter F 20 MILLINER'S ASSISTANT. Hereford, Herefordshire
Percival Alfred Kear Son M 16 APPRENTICE MOTOR ENGINEER. Hereford, Herefordshire

So in all respects this Alfred is clearly well-qualified to own a sewing machine and cycle shop in Cinderford c1902, altho' it seems likely he wasn't it's day-to-day manager.

Cinderford MV Choir, c1902 & 1907, conductor Mr George KEAR (reply)

Jefff — Sat, 14 Oct 2017 15:46:49 +0000

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 03 August 1901
The Cinderford Male Voice Choir performed, under Mr W. M. Everett, at Littledean cottage garden and vegetable show.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 16 August 1902
at the Cinderford 9th annual flower fruit and vegetable show under Mr. George Kear.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 07 May 1904
at the 7th Forest of Dean Eisteddfod under Mr. W. M. Everett.

Gloucestershire Echo - Saturday 13 July 1907
at the Ruardean Band Contest under Mr. G. Kear.

Think this is our man, in Cinderford.
Again no obvious musical links, but presumably a businessman hence organiser etc.

1911 East Dean, Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
George Kear Head M 48 GROCER & BAKER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Emma Anna Kear Wife F 42 ASSISTING IN BUSINESS. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
George Howard Kear Son M 6 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Alice Glastonbury Servant F 20 GENERAL SERVANT DOMESTIC. Cinderford, Gloucestershire

1901 Station Street, St Stephen Parish, East Dean, Glos.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
George Kear Head M 38 Baker & Grocer. East Dean, Gloucestershire
Emma A Kear Wife F 32 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Ivor E Kear Son M 10 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Henry F Kear Son M 9 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Jessie M Kear Daughter F 2 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Ethel M Moore Servant F 15 Gen Servant (Domestic). East Dean, Gloucestershire

Event Type Census
Event Date 1891
County Gloucestershire
Parish East Dean
Ecclesiastical Parish ST STEPHENS
Registration District Westbury On Severn
Residence Note Bilson Road
Gender Male
Age 28
Marital Status Married
Occupation Baker & Confectioner
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Birth Year (Estimated) 1863
Birthplace Gloucestershire, England
Page Number 32
Registration Number RG12
Piece/Folio 2005/ 65

1881 Market Street, East Dean, Glos.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
James Kear Head M 48 Grocer. Yorkley, Gloucestershire, England
Amelia Kear Wife F 49 Littledean Hill, Gloucestershire, England
Florence Kear Daughter F 23 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
George Kear Son M 18 Assistant. Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
William J Kear Son M 13 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Annie Kear Daughter F 10 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Clara Meadows Servant F 19 Domestic Servant. Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England

FreeBMD is having a rest..., but GlosBMD gives these possible births;

Child Surname Child Forename Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
KEAR George PARRY 1865 Forest of Dean Monmouth, Coleford 21 188
KEAR George MOUNTJOY 1862 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 22 417

And a corresponding marriage for George's parents, and then himself;

Groom Surname Groom Forename Bride Surname Bride Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
KEAR James MOUNTJOY Amelia Gloucester Northgate St John the Baptist 1856 55 No 2 331

Groom Surname Groom Forename Bride Surname Bride Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
KEAR George EVANS Emma Anna Forest of Dean Westbury-on-Severn (FoD) Register Office [Closed] 1889 9 32

Record_ID: 108205
Entry_Number: 736
Year: 1956
Month: Mar
Day: 16
Surname: KEAR
Forenames: George
Residence: 14 Station Street Cinderford
Age_at_death: 93 [years]
Officiating_Minister: T Clifford Brown
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes: 24/56 written in margin
Register_Reference: P85/1 IN 1/16
Page_No: 92
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford St John
Soundex: K600

Record_ID: 8946
Entry_Number: 1914
Year: 1940
Month: Apr
Day: 17
Surname: KEAR
Forenames: Emma Anna
Residence: 9 Wesley Road
Age_at_death: 71
Officiating_Minister: Breenes Miller
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P85/1 IN 1/15
Page_No: 240
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford St John
Soundex: K600

Also see these prior threads re Kear family of shopkeepers & bakers of Cinderford and Yorkley.
http://www.forest-of-dean.net/fodmembers/index.php?mode=thread&id=45019

http://www.forest-of-dean.net/fodmembers/index.php?id=5001

=====================

The Kelly's Trade Directory of Cinderford for 1894 lists George and his daughter Florence;

KEAR ______, bakers & grocers

KEAR Florence (Miss.), haberdasher

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cbennett/cinderford1894.htm

The 1902 edition also lists them, as follows, I presume the first named is George's father and now a respected citizen of the town.

CINDERFORD

Private Residents:

KEAR James, J.P.

Commercial:

KEAR Alfred & Co., sewing machine & cycle agents

KEAR Jas. & Sons, bakers & grocers

KEAR Florence (Miss), haberdasher

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cbennett/cinderford1902.htm

Cinderford MV Choir, c1901 & 1904, conductor W.M EVERETT (reply)

Jefff — Sat, 14 Oct 2017 14:12:11 +0000

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 03 August 1901
The Cinderford Male Voice Choir performed, under Mr W. M. Everett, at Littledean cottage garden and vegetable show.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 16 August 1902
at the Cinderford 9th annual flower fruit and vegetable show under Mr. George Kear.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 07 May 1904
at the 7th Forest of Dean Eisteddfod under Mr. W. M. Everett.

Gloucestershire Echo - Saturday 13 July 1907
at the Ruardean Band Contest under Mr. G. Kear.

The newspapers indicate the choir had two conductors during the same era, which seems a little odd ?? Maybe one of them is an occasional "pro", perhaps brought-in from outside the area, so explaining my difficulties in tracing a W.M.EVERETT in this site's PRs, or FreeBMD or even the local Census' using FamilySearch ?. I've looked thro FreeBMD records across Glos, Monmouthshire, Herefordshire, and into Brecon, Worcestershire, Somerset etc. It's possible the surname was mis-spelt, but the alternatives don't yield results either, leastways not for me. I suspect W is for William, or perhaps Walter, lots of William Henry Everetts, but cannot find records anywhere "locally" for W.M.Everett.

Except this one, eventually...,

Births Mar 1871 (>99%)
EVERETT William Miller Monmouth 11a 23

???

My rather belatedly checking this full name (not just William) in FamilySearch Census records appears to find our man, teaching at Cinderford's newly-built senior school;

1901 Double View Road, East Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
William Miller Everett Head M 30 Elementary School Teacher. West Dean, Gloucestershire
Sophia Everett Wife F 24 Islington, London
Constance Everett Daughter F 0 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Ada Jones Servant F 19 Sick Nurse. Cinderford, Gloucestershire

Sadly;

Record_ID: 101241
Entry_Number:
Year: 1901
Month: Apr
Day: 29
Surname: EVERETT
Forenames: Constance Sophia
Residence: Double View R[oa]d
Age_at_death: 1 M[onth]
Officiating_Minister:
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes: Entry followed by 0 and ED
Register_Reference: PA 85/3
Page_No:
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford Baptist
Soundex: E163

1911 West Dean, Blakeney Gloucestershire, Monmouthshire, England
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
William Miller Everett Head M 40 COMMISSION AGENT. Gloshire Yorkley
Sophia Everett Wife F 34 London Stoke Newington, London
Kathleen Sophia Everett Daughter F 9 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
George William Everett Son M 8 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
William Ernest Miller Everett Son M 3 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Howard Everett Son M 0 Crowthorne, Berkshire

So again no obvious signs of a musical background, but definitely educated academic.

1891 Yorkley, West Dean, Monmouthshire.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
William Everetts Head M 52 Roadman. Gloucestershire, England
Jane Everetts Wife F 45 Merionethshire, England
Mary J Everetts Daughter F 22 Assistant Mistress School. Gloucestershire, England
William Everetts Son M 20 Master Board School. Gloucestershire, England
Annie Everetts Daughter F 16 Pupil Teacher. Gloucestershire, England
George Everetts Son M 14 Gloucestershire, England
Arthur Everetts Son M 12 Gloucestershire, England
Thomas Everetts Son M 11 Gloucestershire, England
Kate Everetts Daughter F 5 Gloucestershire, England

1881 Toll Gate, Monmouth, West Dean (Gloucs), Monmouthshire, Wales
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
William Everett Head M 42 Roadman. Breadston, Gloucestershire, England
Jane Everett Wife F 35 Merioneth, Merionethshire, Wales
Mary Jane Everett Daughter F 12 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England
William Everett Son M 10 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Annie Everett Daughter F 6 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England
George Z Everett Son M 4 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Arthur Charles Everett Son M 2 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Thomas N Everett Son M 1 West Dean, Gloucestershire, England

Breadstone is across the Severn near Berkeley.
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/GLS/Berkeley/Gaz1868

It appears William has lived in other parts of the UK, explaining his apparent absence from the BMD records I looked at. Trying again;

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page
Marriages Jun 1900 (>99%)
Elmer Sophia Easthampstead 2c 891
Everett William Miller Easthampstead 2c 891

1891 Church St, Easthampstead (modern Bracknell), Berkshire.
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
George Elmer Head M 50 Carrier. Suffolk, England
Mary S Elmer Wife F 44 Oxfordshire, England
James Albert Elmer Son M 19 Bakers Assistant. Middlesex, England
George Phillip Elmer Son M 17 Carpenter. Middlesex, England
Sophia Elmer Daughter F 14 Middlesex, England
Gertrude Elmer Daughter F 11 Middlesex, England
Jesse Elmer Son M 9 Middlesex, England
Nellie Elmer Daughter F 7 Hertfordshire, England
Ernest Elmer Son M 4 Berkshire, England

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page
Births Jun 1876 (>99%)
ELMER Mary Sophia Hackney 1b 585

Struggling to find the couple in later life.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir, conductor Harry R. DOBBS (reply)

Mike Pinchin — Sat, 14 Oct 2017 09:37:34 +0000

Expanding on the BNA references,

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 04 September 1937

FOREST MINERS’ CHOIR
The musical miners of the Forest of Dean will be on the air Friday, September 24. Cinderford Male Voice Choir has been engaged to broadcast from 8.10 p.m. to 8.50 p.m. on that date, from the Bristol Studio………………………………………..Mr Harry Dobbs has been conductor ever since the choir was founded, 25 years ago, and the success of the organisation is a great tribute to him.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 08 March 1913

………. the second annual concert of the Cinderford Male Voice Choir – Conductor Mr H. Dobbs……….

These imply the choir was founded c1912 but I wonder if it was the revival of an earlier choir,

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 03 August 1901

The Cinderford Male Voice Choir performed, under Mr W. M. Everett, at Littledean cottage garden and vegetable show.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 16 August 1902

at the Cinderford 9th annual flower fruit and vegetable show under Mr. George Kear.

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 07 May 1904
at the 7th Forest of Dean Eisteddfod under Mr. W. M. Everett.

Gloucestershire Echo - Saturday 13 July 1907

at the Ruardean Band Contest under Mr. G. Kear.

Gloucester Citizen - Friday 23 August 1907

at Cinderford Town Hall under Mr George Kear.

The earliest reference to a broadcast by the choir I can find is,

Gloucester Journal - Saturday 22 October 1932

CINDERFORD CONCERT The Miners’ Welfare Hall at Cinderford was filled last evening, when the Cinderford Male Voice Choir gave their Autumnal broadcast concert…………………
…………………..The items of the programme, which were broadcast from the West Regional Station, Cardiff, were…………………

Cinderford Male Voice Choir, conductor Harry R. DOBBS (reply)

probinson — Sat, 14 Oct 2017 08:28:08 +0000

There's a lot of newspaper articles about them in the newspaper archive but I only have a pay as you go account so didn't read them. Mostly about appearances though as far as I could tell. One does say "... PRESENTATION TO CINDERFORD CONDUCTOR Thirty-seven years conductor of Cinderford male voice choir were recognised on Saturday when a presentation was made to Mr. Harry Dobbs, who has recently retired from the position, and has been succeeded ..." dated 5 Dec. 1949. Another says "Another concert w»s provided by the Cinderford Male Voice Choir, conducted Mr. Alfred Roberts", dated 20 Dec 1949, so presumably he was the new conductor. There's also a few references to radio appearances including at the 'new' studio at Bristol.

Cinderford, Harry R. DOBBS's parents. (reply)

Jefff — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 23:50:34 +0000

Also in the PRs are Robert's parents;

Record_ID: 101372
Entry_Number:
Year: 1932
Month: Nov
Day: 7
Surname: DOBBS
Forenames: Robert
Residence: 1 High St[reet] Westbury on Severn
Age_at_death: 82 Y[ears]
Officiating_Minister:
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes: Entry followed by 353 and Newnham / WoS
Register_Reference: PA 85/3
Page_No:
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford Baptist
Soundex: D120

Record_ID: 101355
Entry_Number:
Year: 1924
Month: Jan
Day: 7
Surname: DOBBS
Forenames: Mary Ann
Residence: Station R[oa]d Cinderford
Age_at_death: 73 Y[ears]
Officiating_Minister:
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes: Entry followed by 302 and ED / WoS
Register_Reference: PA 85/3
Page_No:
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford Baptist
Soundex: D120

Record_ID: 6820
Entry_Number: 278
Year: 1850
Month: Feb
Day: 13
Parents_Surname: DOBBS
Child_Forenames: Robert
Fathers_Forenames: Luke
Mothers_Forenames: Lydia
Mothers_Surname:
Residence: Woodside
Occupation: Labourer
Officiating_Minister: J G Smythies
Event: Baptism
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P85 IN 1/1
Page_Number: 35
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford St John
Soundex: D120

1851. ???, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Luke Dobbs Head M 29 Labourer. Marylebone, London
Lydia Dobbs Wife F 39 Little Dean, Gloucestershire
William Beard Step Son M 17 Iron Miner. East Dean, Gloucestershire
Samuel Beard Step Son M 14 Errand Boy. East Dean, Gloucestershire
Luke Dobbs Son M 3 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Robert Dobbs Son M 1 East Dean, Gloucestershire

--

Record_ID: 6711
Entry_Number: 169
Year: 1848
Month: Jan
Day: 16
Parents_Surname: DOBBS
Child_Forenames: Luke John
Fathers_Forenames: Luke John
Mothers_Forenames: Lydia
Mothers_Surname:
Residence: Ruspidge
Occupation: Miner
Officiating_Minister: J G Smythies
Event: Baptism
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P85 IN 1/1
Page_Number: 22
Parish_Chapel: Cinderford St John
Soundex: D120

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Jun 1844 (>99%)
Beard Lydia Westbury on S 11 643
Dobbs Luke Westbury S 11 643

GlosBMD helpfully gives Lydia's maiden name,

Groom Surname Groom Forename Bride Surname Bride Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
DOBBS Luke HAYWARD Lydia Forest of Dean Westbury-on-Severn (FoD) Register Office 1844 1 3
DOBBS Luke BEARD Lydia Forest of Dean Westbury-on-Severn (FoD) Register Office 1844 1 3

So can find

Record_ID: 189
Entry_Number: 189
Year: 1832
Month: Dec
Day: 24
Grooms_Surname: BEARD
Grooms_Forenames: Thomas
Grooms_Age:
Groom_Condition: [not stated]
Grooms_Occupation:
Grooms_Residence: Hund[re]d of St. Braivils
Grooms_Fathers_Surname:
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames:
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation:
Brides_Surname: HAYWARD
Brides_Forenames: Lydia
Brides_Age:
Brides_Condition: [not stated]
Brides_Occupation:
Brides_Residence: Hund[re]d of St. Braivils
Brides_Fathers_Surname:
Brides_Fathers_Forenames:
Brides_Fathers_Occupation:
Licence_or_Banns: Banns
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark: Both sign
Witness_1: W[illia]m Beard
Witness_2: Mark of Anne Hayward
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister: Edmund Probyn Rector
Event: Marriage
Memoranda: with consent of friends
Notes:
Register_Reference: P1 IN 1/9
Page_Number: 63
Parish_Chapel: Abenhall
Soundex_Groom: B630
Soundex_Bride: H630

--

1871. East Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Robert Dobbs Head M 21 Mason. East Dean, Gloucestershire
Mary Ann Dobbs Wife F 21 East Dean, Gloucestershire
Lydia Ann Dobbs Daughter F 0 East Dean, Gloucestershire

1911. East Dean, Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Hannah Davis Head F 70 WIDOW. OLD AGE PENSIONER. Glosshire Camm
Robert Dobbs Brother-in-law M 61 COLLIERY MASON ABOVE GROUND. Glosshire Cinderford
Mary Ann Dobbs Sister-in-law F 61 Glosshire Cinderford
Isabella Dobbs Niece F 25 Glosshire Cinderford

Suggests Mary Ann Dobbs' maiden name is Davis.

Groom Surname Groom Forename Bride Surname Bride Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
DOBBS Robert DAVIS Mary Ann Forest of Dean Westbury-on-Severn (FoD) Register Office [Closed] 1870 4 37

Cinderford Male Voice Choir, conductor Harry R. DOBBS (reply)

Jefff — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 23:04:31 +0000

An internet search gave this reference to the Choir being broadcast at primetime on BBC Regional BBC Radio at Christmas 1934, they must have been good !.

http://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/schedules/regional/western/1934-12-22#at-19.00

The conductor that day is given as Harry R. Dobbs.
I cannot yet find him in this site's PRs, but FreeBMD & GlosBMD has;

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page
Births Mar 1874 (>99%)
Dobbs Harry Robert Westbury S. 6a 243

Child Surname Child Forename Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
DOBBS Harry Robert DAVIS 1873 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 36 363

----

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page
Marriages Mar 1908 (>99%)
CHIVERS Mary Ann Westbury S. 6a 395
Dobbs Harry Robert Westbury S. 6a 395
Meredith Elizabeth Ann Westbury S 6a 395
MORRIS Edward Westbury S. 6a 395

Marriage Details
Groom Surname & Forename Bride Surname & Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
DOBBS Harry Robert CHIVERS Mary Ann Forest of Dean Cinderford Baptist Chapel 1908 1 16

----

Deaths Jun 1961 (>99%)
DOBBS Harry R 87 Gloucester C. 7b 411

FamilySearch shows him in Cinderford most his life, some interesting occupations here, but sadly no hint of a musical background;

1881. High St, East Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Robert Dobbs Head M 31 Mason. Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Mary A Dobbs Wife F 31 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Lydia A Dobbs Daughter F 10 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Harry R Dobbs Son M 7 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Eva H Dobbs Daughter F 4 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Fredk W Dobbs Son M 2 Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England

1891. Bilson Green, East Dean, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event BirthplaceBirthplace
Robert Dobbs Head M 41 Mason. Gloucestershire, England
M A Dobbs Wife F 41 Gloucestershire, England
S A Dobbs Daughter F 20 Gloucestershire, England
H R Dobbs Son M 17 Grocers Assistant. Gloucestershire, England
E H Dobbs Daughter F 14 Gloucestershire, England
W F Dobbs Son M 12 Gloucestershire, England
H T Dobbs Son M 9 Gloucestershire, England
T R Dobbs Daughter F 7 Gloucestershire, England
J M Dobbs Daughter F 5 Gloucestershire, England

1901. Trinity Rd, Aston Manor, Warwickshire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Robert Dobbs Head M 51 BRICKLAYER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Mary Ann Dobbs Wife F 51 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Harry Robt Dobbs Son M 27 SHELL TURNER AMMUNITION WORKS. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Fredk Wm Dobbs Son M 22 CARPENTER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Harold Tom Dobbs Son M 19 GEM SETTER JEWELLER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Julia Kate Dobbs Daughter F 17 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Isabel Maria Dobbs Daughter F 15 Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Victor Laurence Trafford Boarder M 25 STATIONER'S ASSISTANT. Leck, Staffordshire

1911. East Dean, Cinderford, Gloucestershire, England
Household Role Sex Age Event Birthplace
Harry Dobbs Head M 37 OUTFITTER MANAGER. Cinderford, Gloucestershire
Mary Ann Dobbs Wife F 35 Cinderford, Gloucestershire

----

The only family members I can find in this site's PRs is Robert's younger sister, who appears to have married well;

Record_ID: 83352
Entry_Number: 132
Year: 1916
Month: Dec
Day: 23
Grooms_Surname: OAKEY
Grooms_Forenames: William Edwin
Grooms_Age: 27
Groom_Condition: Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation: Colliery Manager
Grooms_Residence: Cinderford
Grooms_Fathers_Surname: OAKEY
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames: William
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation: Colliery Overman
Brides_Surname: DOBBS
Brides_Forenames: Isabel Maria
Brides_Age: 30
Brides_Condition: Spinster
Brides_Occupation:
Brides_Residence: Harry Hill
Brides_Fathers_Surname: DOBBS
Brides_Fathers_Forenames: Robert
Brides_Fathers_Occupation: Mason
Licence_or_Banns: Banns
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark: Both Sign
Witness_1: Robert Dobbs
Witness_2: Mabel Mary Woodward
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister: James Lawton Vicar
Event: Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P109 IN 1/10
Page_Number: 66
Parish_Chapel: Drybrook
Soundex_Groom: O200
Soundex_Bride: D120

continued..

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

ACP — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:35:23 +0000

Many thanks for the link. I have downloaded it.
ACP

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

ACP — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:18:33 +0000

Thank you for your offer, I would love to see it.It may be a bit early for my grandfather to be on it becauase he was living at Ruardean then, but you never know!
ACP

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

probinson — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:11:19 +0000

I have a cutting which includes a picture of the choir. It can be downloaded from https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B4O3Tuo7UDz3ekFYSEhGN0hhT2c

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

jhhoughton — Fri, 13 Oct 2017 19:36:38 +0000

Hello,
I have come across a photo dated 1930 with all the choir in it,with a lady
& 2 cups.
If you would like it let me know.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

peteressex — Thu, 02 Jun 2011 21:58:25 +0000

When I was looking for newspaper archive material about 3 years ago I found Cinderford Library more helpful than local press. You can order up stuff and book time on their microfiche viewer if you don't want to chance getting access if you just roll up. However, the Forester offices were also prepared to grant access to old copies they held of the Lydney Observer.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

ACP — Thu, 02 Jun 2011 12:01:28 +0000

Many thanks for your reply. I think there was both the Cinderford Choral Society mentioned on the Sungreen site & Cinderford Male Voice Choir! Your mention of newspapers set me thinking that maybe Cinderford library might be the place to start.I've also sent an e mail to The Forester asking about archives.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir (reply)

Jefff — Wed, 01 Jun 2011 15:20:34 +0000

I suspect you've already seen this reference, sorry no pictures, from the Sungreen site.
http://www.sungreen.co.uk/Cinderford/Images/germany-august-1918.jpg

As a general question to the Forum, does this site have any direct relationships with the local newspapers such as "The Forester" ex "DF Mercury" in Cinderford.
I'm ashamed to say despite my sister working the front desk for them, she's not too forthcoming when I enquire about what achives they may keep and how to access them. This is 'cos they've all been under considerable pressure following changes of operating systems and then ownership this last year or three, she's always "too busy" to help me. That said it now appears to be a privately owned business and not part of a wider group as it was last year, so maybe they're a good port of call for old news such as this enquiry ?. In their shoes I'd try hard to utilise & promote any such archives they have, as I'm sure they do whereever possible. If I still lived locally I'd make enquiries.
I do know when I bought some old papers on a wellknown internet auction site some years back they were from a Coalway gent, apparently rescued from their old premises on Woodside street (is it still there ?), I believe the papers were then being printed at Gloster ?. That gent turned out to be Rod Neep who I gather is a prominent local historian and may well be a member of this forum ?.

"The Forester"s new website is

http://www.cinderfordforester.co.uk/index.cfm

ps I will try and dig out those papers and look for the Choir etc.

Cinderford Male Voice Choir

ACP — Wed, 01 Jun 2011 13:08:27 +0000

Does anyone have any photos of this choir or any information? I believe it was formed about 1912 and was disbanded perhaps in the 1950's? I think they met at St Stephens Church. My grandfather Jim Wood was a second tenor in the choir and had previously sang in Ruardean Church Choir as a boy. My mother also remembers them doing a radio broadcast at the BBC in Bristol. I would be very grateful for any information; as they no longer exist it's difficult to find anything.