The Mystery of Mr Cinderey

Me and my dad are direct descentants of Mr Cinderey the quarry owner who donated stone to the building of Holy Trinity Church,Drybrook.Where my gt.gt.gt.grandfather George Cinderey Jnr. married Abiah Marfell in 1860. Is there any marriage records for Holy Trinity,Drybrook 1820 onwards this will answer two questions the maiden name of George Snr's wife Elizabeth and Mr Cinderey's first name (if given). We also want to know is there any records concerning quarries in the forest,if so could someone please tell me where they are keep.

Thanking in advance

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I still find this a mystery. The earliest George I have found is a George Sindry b.01 Sept 1809 to Guy Sindre b.04 July 1784 m. 29 Nov 1808 to Susannah James c.1789, living at Linton. George possibly married Betsey Wilkes b.29 May 1814 of Mitcheldean. (No proof of this.)

The problem with the name of Sindrey(my name)is that they can spell it umpteen ways.

George and Betsey(who latterly becomes Elizabeth)always lived at Harry Hill and are named as follows:-
1841 C. Sindary
1851 C. Cindry
1861 C. Sindery
1871 C. Cindry
1881 C. Cindery
1891 C. Cinderey
In each census George is listed as being a sawyer.

They had seven children (I have their details) George c.1836, their second son married Abia Marfell, 16 May 1860 at Holy Trinity, Drybrook. This record shows that George, senior and George, junior were sawyers.Abiah's father Edmund Marfell was a quarryman.

On the list of suscriptions made to the fund for enlarging the school at Drybrook, in June 1896 the name Cinderey featured five times.

George's wife Abiah died in 1891.He appears to have married again because in the 1901 census he is married to Annie c.1841 from Sandhurst. It says he is a weighman(if I read it correctly). I have no proof of this marriage.

I am mystified because neither of the Georges seem to have anything to do with quarrying.

George-senior died Mar 1895 aged 85, registered at Westbury on Severn
Elizabeth died Mar 1901 aged 80, registered at Westbury on Severn.

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A.L.Duesbury

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My main interest is in the Marfell Family, but I always follow parents & siblings and therefore have the Cinderey connection documented following the marriage between Abia Marfell baptised 16.12.1835/buried 29.1.1891 and George Cinderey. I cannot add to your Cinderey information as except that I have a photograph of the gravestone for George Cinderey & Abia on which is included their son George & his wife Sarah Ann. The quality of the text is not brilliant (fungus not photography)and would be happy to email it if you provide details.
A number of Brain's marry into the Marfell family and researching via this brilliant web site's Parish records yesterday I spotted the marriage between John Cinderey born 1854 (son of George Cinderey & Elizabeth) and Elizabeth Brain born 1850, the marriage took place at the Church of Holy Trinity Drybrook 20.12.1873. Elizabeth Brain is the daughter of Simeon Brain & Ann Marfell. I cannot find details on the 1881 Census, but would be interested in any further details from correspondents to this link.

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Possibly your Elizabeth and John?
1881 England Census - living at 2 Providence Place Freeman Road Aston Warwickshire John is listed as Railway Signalman
Annie E. Cinderey abt 1875 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Elizabeth Cinderey abt 1851 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Wife Aston Warwickshire
Hedley G. Cinderey Aston,(4 months) Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
John Cinderey abt 1854 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Head Aston Warwickshire
John H. Cinderey abt 1877 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Lilly C. Cinderey abt 1879 Aston, Warwickshire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire

1891 England Census As Transcribed!
Annie E Aixterey abt 1875 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Elizabeth Aixterey abt 1851 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Wife Aston Warwickshire
Ellen L Aixterey abt 1887 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Hedley G Aixterey abt 1881 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
John Aixterey abt 1854 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Head Aston Warwickshire
John H Aixterey abt 1875 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Lillie C Aixterey abt 1879 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Sydney B Aixterey abt 1888 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
William J Aixterey abt 1885 Birmingham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Smicow Black abt 1851 Whitacre, Warwickshire, England Lodger Aston Warwickshire

1901 England Census As transcribed
Cecil Redvers Cenderey abt 1900 Bham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Elizabeth Cenderey abt 1851 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Wife Aston Warwickshire
Eller Lydia Cenderey abt 1887 Bham, Warwickshire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Hedley Geo Cenderey abt 1881 Bham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
John Cenderey abt 1854 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Head Aston Warwickshire
John Herbert abt 1877 Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Lillie Clara Cenderey abt 1879 Bham, Warwickshire, England Daughter Aston Warwickshire
Sydney Bern Cenderey abt 1888 Bham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire
Will James Cenderey abt 1885 Bham, Warwickshire, England Son Aston Warwickshire

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Finding new ways to spell Vaughan every day!

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Thanks everyone the John Cinderey is news to me so thanks jim. Ann thanks also for giving Edmund Marfell's job as a quarryman thanks again everyone

hullforester

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Just to add to the Marfell side of the Cindery's; George Cinderey's wife was Abia Marfell who you know is the daughter of Edmund Marfell (parents Moses Marfell & Ann Teague) he was baptised 27.7.1800 Mitcheldean and died 3.1.1880 Mitcheldean, buried 7.1.1880 Church of Holy Trinity Drybrook, his wife was Anne Burdock born 1804 Upleadon and died 18.10.1871 Mitcheldean, buried 22.10.1871 Church of Holy Trinity Drybrook.The marriage took place 2.1.1833 Hempstead. Abia was one of 8 children for Edmund & Anne, her brother Hiram born 15.5.1838 was a little unusual in that I have two birth certificates for him as his birth was registered twice. He emigrated to USA in 1870 where he married an Elizabeth Flannagan 24.5.1882 in Denver Colorado. He owned land in Eerie Colorado and was a mine operator, I have his obituary which makes interesting reading, another unusual event was that he sued the Union Pacific Railway together with his partners - and won. I have photographs of road signs "Marfell Court" and "Marfell Street" in Erie Colorado, which no doubt are a result of Hiram.

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A possible answer.
This would appear to be the family in 1851 (GFHS transcription):

1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY George HD M 39 Sawyer GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY Betsey WI M 36 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY William SO U 17 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY George SO - 15 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY Elizabeth DA - 13 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY Biah DA - 8 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY Ann DA - 5 - GLS East Dean
1959 0183 102 Harry Hill CINDRY Sarah DA - 3 - GLS East Dean

The next family is this one:

1959 0183 103 Harry Hill WILKS Sarah HD W 76 Yarn Spinner HEF Castlemorton
1959 0183 103 Harry Hill WILKS Joseph SO U 41 Collier GLS East Dean

This entry from GFHS Marriage Index:
7 July 1832 George SINDERBY of Hundred of St Briavels married Elizabeth WILKES of Hundred of St Briavels by Banns at Abenhall.
Further details available on this website under Parish Records.

This baptism entry from IGI:
29 May 1814 Betsey WILKES baptised at Mitcheldean. Parents Joseph WILKES and Sarah.

This would appear to be burial of Joseph WILKES:
Date: 21 MAR 1827
First Name: JOSEPH
Surname: WILKS
Age: 57
Burial Register: EAST DEAN(DRYBROOK) HOLY TRINITY 1817-1839
Place of Abode: HARRY HILL

Mike

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and in 1841 as transcribed ( ancestry)

The only Cindary family in the area is this George - a sawyer.

1841 Harry Hill
Geroge Sindary abt 1811 Dean Forest Gloucestershire Sawyer
Betty Sindary abt 1814 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Elizabeth Sindary abt 1838 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
George Sindary abt 1836 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Mary Ann Sindary abt 1840 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
William Sindary abt 1834 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire

just off Harry Hill
in Drybrook / Nailbridge; the Quarry is in the hands of the Marfell family.
a generation earlier the Hale history suggests it was in the hands of a George Cindary and the donation of stone led to a family rift. Did George sell up ?

1841
Edmund Marfell abt 1801 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire Quarryman
Ann Marfell abt 1806 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Abia Marfell abt 1836 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Leah Marfell abt 1841 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Mary Ann Marfell abt 1834 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Thiram Marfell abt 1838 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire

and back at the Parsonage House of Holy Trinity , Quarry Hill

1841
Henry Berkin abt 1781 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire Rector
Maria Linea Berkin abt 1771 Dean Forest Gloucestershire
Adelaide Jenkins abt 1821 Dean Forest Gloucestershire Female Servant
Ann Marfell abt 1826 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire Female Servant
Timothy Marfell abt 1821 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire Male Servant
Sarah White abt 1821 Gloucestershire, England Dean Forest Gloucestershire Female Servant

Timothy and Ann are brother/sister

Year 1821
Month Mar
Day 11
Parents Surname MARFELL
Child Forename(s) Timothy
Father's Forename(s) Cornelius
Mother's Forename(s) Tamen
Mother's Surname
Place of Residence Ruardean Hill
Occupation Labourer
Officiating Minister H. Berkin
Event type C

Year 1824
Month Jan
Day 25
Parents Surname MARFELL
Child Forename(s) Ann
Father's Forename(s) Cornelius
Mother's Forename(s) Tamen

earlier threads
http://www.forum.forest-of-dean.net/index.php?mode=thread&id=2270#p2291

http://www.forum.forest-of-dean.net/index.php?mode=thread&id=2374#p2394

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Ἀριστοτέλης A Gloster Boy in the Forest of Dean ><((((*>

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And so the saga continues.Here's some more for the jigsaw.

George Cinderey 01 Sep 1809 appears to be the eldest in the family. There were two sons. The other was Henry 08 Mar 1812. They also had four daughters.

Their father Guy Sindre (yet another spelling) b.o4 July 1784 at Linton, died fairly young on 18 Mar 1828. So George was only nineteen. As George was young maybe he couldn't cope with a business.

Guy's wife Susannah James c.1789, poss. Susannah, born 01 Jan 1789 at Weston under Penyard, then married James Welsh, a widower on 04 Mar 1833 at English Bicknor. The marriage record spells her name as Sinderrey. She lived until Mar 1872.

Thanks once again from Ann Sindrey, to the Parish record transposers for the marriage information.

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A.L.Duesbury

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As my main interest is the Marfell family I would be very interested in any information pertaining to the Marfell Family being owners of the quarry. I do not think that the connection is Edmund Marfell. He is described variously on census data and a number of birth & marriage certificates for his children as Quarryman, which is rather far removed from Quarry Owner. The only variation to this are; the birth of his daughter Leah 1n 1841 where he is a collier. On the marriage certificate for his daughter Belinda in 1870 he is a Farmer and then on the 1871 Census he is a haulier.
The fact that Timothy & Ann Marfell are servants with the Reverand Birkin is a bit of a red herring, they are indeed brother & sister each second cousin to Edmund i.e. not closely related. Timothy went on to marry Ellen Hyett in 1858, they had no children and he was Labourer/Gardener. Ann went on to marry Simeon Brain in 1845, they had 10 children including Elizabeth 1850 who married John Cinderey 20.12.1873, John being the son of George Cinderey & Elizabeth Wilkes i.e. brother of George who married Abia Marfell. Timothy & Ann Marfell were part of a family of 9 children, their brother Cornelius born 1832 was my Great Great Grandfather who married his cousin Mary Ann Marfell in 1853 & was killed in an Iron Mine accident in 1865. I have two newspaper reports for the accident, one of which no doubt typical for the era I find rather quaint :
"Cornelius Marfell killed in iron ore mine accident Wigpool Colliery nr. Mitcheldean 8 May 1865. Left 6 children Thomas, Timothy, Lydia, Rose, Annie,John, John being baby in arms"
Details of funeral in Coleford Times 19.5.1865
"The funeral of the unfortunate man, Cornelius Marfell took place on Friday evening and was conducted in a respectable manner, no less than 88 persons attending dressed in black and the majority wore white gloves and hat bands"

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Quarryman, which is rather far removed from Quarry Owner

point taken , however I can't recall other quarry workers on that census close by, only miners...perhaps I need to go back and recheck :-)

is a bit of a red herring,

only attempting to illustrate how all these families tend to inter twin :-)

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Ἀριστοτέλης A Gloster Boy in the Forest of Dean ><((((*>

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Since the posting of my suggested answer to this mystery I have looked at my copy of The Victoria History of the County of Gloucester Volume V The Forest of Dean.
This tells us that the Holy Trinity Church, Drybrook was opened in 1817 and consecrated later the same year. It was built as a free chapel by its first minister Henry BERKIN then curate of Weston under Penyard who began holding services in the Forest in 1812 while at Mitcheldean.
We are therefore looking for a Mr CINDEREY of a generation before George.

Mike

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Thank you Michael, for information about Betsey Wilkes.

I would also like to thank Graham Davison for sending me information that has filled a few gaps.

GEORGE CINDEREY b.01 Sept 1809, is not my direct family line, but I have found so many facts, I have had to "go with the flow" as they say.

My gt.gt.gt.grandfather WILLIAM SINDRY b.15 Aug 1777 was the brother of GEORGE'S father, GUY b.04 July 1784.
-------------------------------------
GUY SINDRY b. 27 Nov 1738 of Lea or Weston under Penyard married 09 Aug 1751 to ANN LODGE of Brompton Abbots.They had:-

Martha b.29 Oct 1775 - (recorded parents Guy and Nancy - error perhaps?)
WILLIAM b. 15 Aug 1777 married 26 Dec 1802 to MARY MORGAN c.1771.
Mary b. 07 May 1780.
Hannah b.14 Apr 1789.
GUY b. 04 July 1784 - buried 18 Mar 1828 at Hundred of St Briavels married to SUSANNAH JAMES c.1789.
-------------------------------------
GUY SINDRE living at Linton, b.04 July 1784 - 18 Mar 1828, married 29 Nov 1808 to SUSANNAH JAMES c.1789. Could she be Susan James b.12 Apr 1789 at Weston under Penyard? They had:-

GEORGE b.01 Sept 1809 married 07 July 1832 at Abenhall to ELIZABETH WILKES b.29 May 1814.
Henry b. 08 Mar 1812 married 01 Jan 1837 to Mary Ann Mountjoy of Awre with Blakeney.
Susannah b. 07 Nov 1817 married Jun 1842 to Jonathan Rudge.
Mary Ann b.07 Nov 1819.
Charlotte b.13 Jan 1825.
Abiah c.1825

After her husband, Guy died 18 Mar 1828 at Hundred of St Briavels,Susannah married 04 Mar 1833 to James Welsh. In the 1841 census Charlotte and Abiah are living with them at Hope Mansell. James family are next door.
-----------------------------------
I have well documented evidence for the two generations prior to GUY and ANN LODGE. This takes us back to WILLIAM SYNDRY c.16?? - 16 June 1731 and Margarett his wife. They lived at Castle End, Lea where William farmed and was Church Warden at St. John's, Lea. I have a copy of William's will which has given me true facts.

A number of my ancestors were blacksmiths and sawyers. George's family were mainly sawyers. So who is going to find the quarry owner? Maybe it's one of those female Teagues married to a Cinderey!

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A.L.Duesbury

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Thanks again everyone this is great progress keep it up!
Elizabeth Wilkes's dad Joseph died before she wed George Snr and so it seems George's dad had too. Thanks again from the forester up north.

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Sorry about the long delay everyone, a new theory has come into my head maybe the Cinderey's were quarry owners but George snr wasn't the oldest son so he had to find another job and his brother carried on the quarry.

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I know that sawyers mainly saw timber for a living but stone is also sawn ,could this be a clue?

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Thanks again everyone for the info it looks like the George Cindary who owned the quarry before the Marfells is a Londoner! born in 1755 to a John Sindry and his wife Mary in Stepney, London what do you think of that!

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Hullforester.

Please can you explain how you came by this information? It seems so different to anything discovered so far.

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A.L.Duesbury

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I searched another website that has copies of parish records. This George's family came from Kent.But i think we are looking for another "Forest Cinderey" as George Cinderey of East Dean's dad, i believed his father was called William but it is likely George we need more christening records before 1813 to see if George had any brothers or sisters to confirm that "George Cindary" is his father.

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I understand that the Mr Cinderey (however spelled) the quarry owner who donated the stone, was also a church warden, which seems reasonable. If this is correct, his full name is likely to appear in parish council or whatever church records were maintained at the time. I understand that these records are at the Gloucester Records Office. Has anyone checked these?

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I'd like to make my contribution to this discussion on the CINDEREY family. George CINDEREY born about 1869 at Harry Hill, whom I believe is a son of George CINDEREY of East Dean, married Sarah Ann MEEK (December Q 1892 Westbury vol., 6a, page 455). In the 1901 Census this couple are recorded at Morse Lane, Ruardean, Herefordshire. RG 13/2475, folio 131, page 14, schedule 86.

George CINDEREY head of household, married male aged 32, Carpenter, worker, born Harry Hill, Gloucestershire.

Sarah A. CINDEREY wife aged 29, born Weston under Penyard.

George CINDEREY son aged 7, born Drybrook, Gloucestershire.

Hilda A. CINDEREY daughter aged 5, born Drybrook, Gloucestershire.

Percy H. CINDEREY daughter aged 3, born Drybrook, Gloucestershire.

Mabel A. CINDEREY daughter aged 2, born Cheltenham, Gloucestershire.

Sarah Ann MEEK was a daughter of James MEEK and Celia MEEK nee BURTON. Sarah was born at Weston under Penyard on the 29 March 1872, and baptised at Hope Mansell, Herefordshire on the 28 April 1872.

Celia BURTON was was a daughter of John BURTON and Elizabeth BURTON nee HULIN of St Briavels, Gloucestershire. I am related to Elizabeth HULIN.

It was interesting to note that James MEEK was, in the 1861 Census working at Wallow Farm, Weston under Penyard, for the family of the then farm Bailiff William HALFORD and in the next household was George MEEK, whom I believe was a brother of James MEEK. See RG 9/1814, folio 15, page 3, schedules 13 & 14

In the 1851 Census this George MEEK was then working at Wallow Farm with William MARFELL, Farm Bailiff, head of household. See HO 107/1976 folio 283, page 16, schedule 57.

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After looking for the birth of Hilda A. CINDEREY on the BMD Index, I found her recorded with the surname of CINDERLEY - Hilda Abiah, Westbury Sept Q 1895 - 6a, 262. There was also a Caroline CINDERLEY or CINDERBY (sic) married to a John BULLOCK at Westbury June Q 1849 - 11, 663. Also, a marriaged for a Mary CINDERLEY at Lewisham, Greater London/Kent, December Q 1839 - 5, 362; to either James MACKIE (of potential interest to me), or Thomas WELLER or another un-named male.

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Don Cameron

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Further to my last post - there are far too many CINDERY listings on the BMD Index to note here. It might be well to check all possible permutations of this name on the BMD Index and elsewhere.

[Thread locked, please start a new thread with a new subject - admin]

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Don Cameron

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Here is a good example of what can be found

Marriages Dec 1887
CONDEREY Lydia Westbury S. 6a 438
JONES George Westbury S. 6a 438

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Don Cameron

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Don the Lydia Conderey is George and Abiah's daugther. Thanks for That!

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