Foundry House, Milkwall - Forest of Dean FHT Forum

Have just found burial and address information about George Frowen, burial 1945 age 83 and address Foundry House Milkwall. Does anyone know what sort of house this was and where it was in Milkwall..His son George died in France in WW1. Thanks a lot, euansma

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Hi,
I don't know Milkwall very well, hopefully you do, but I'll contact my bro-in-law in Coalway this week who may be able to help. In the meantime are you on Ancestry or similar ?, sadly I'm not. If you are then I suggest search the 1911, 1901 etc Census' just for "Foundry House Milkwall" or "Foundry Cottage Milkwall" etc. If it could be found, hopefully the neighbouring households and maybe landmarks such as pubs will give clues as to where the house was/is.
(Unless of course you know the Frowens were already there at that time ?)

Despite thorough online searching I've found no hints whatsoever of such an address in Milkwall. (There is a "Foundry Houses" address just north, in Coalway, but I cannot see how they could be interpreted as Milkwall. This lack of findings surprises me a little - you probably know that the Milkwall area was full of iron mines in the past, hence I'd expect to see a few foundries too to process the iron ore into castings or even steel.
This 1894 map shows just how many iron mines there were, indicated by brown spots rather than the usual black for coal mines.
http://lightmoor.co.uk/forestcoal/Staunton.html

So, my suspicion is that Foundry House will be near to a foundry aka iron/steel works, possibly even a substantial house built for/by the works owner ??

The above map also shows the route of the Severn & Wye Railway, and Milkwall Station, all marked in blue. Inside the bend below Milkwall Station see "steel works".

This excellent Ordnance Survey map from 1884 has a building labelled "steel works(disused)" (with it's blue pond).
(Zoom into the lower R/H corner of this page using your mousewheel)
http://maps.nls.uk/view/101453631
The same site's later maps show the now un-named works becomes part of the expanding Gorsty Knoll quarry.

I think this Steel Works must be a later part of the important old Darkhill Furnaces complex, the remains of which were a few yards to the south-east.. just off this map, sorry for my bad luck, I always seem to be on the edge of any map !

The adjoining map can be seen here, in 1924 version;
http://maps.nls.uk/view/102346004

Despite the labelling suggesting that it's placed further south, the original Dark Hill complex is actually situated at the southern end of Gorsty Knoll but definitely north of the Ellwood-Coalway Road, and just north/inside the old railway line loop. The outline of the complex walls is marked just below the open triangle-shaped area, by the word "coal level". Look up/left to northwest and the aforementioned "steel works" is under the "old quarry" & "spr" labels. The "spring" for a copious water supply is essential for steel making.

Hopefully the maps display well for you, they're very detailed but I cannot see any buildings marked Foundry House, just a Quarry House, but I do suspect your Foundry House was/is nearby the general Dark Hill area !.

I do hope you are happy viewing the old maps, I find them fascinating and very helpful, but I appreciate they're not everyone's cup of tea. I also know from experience some computers struggle to load them, hope not for you. Regarding the Darkhill Furnaces complex, the outlines shown on the maps nicely match this aerial photo, viewed from due east, it's also clearly visible on Google Earth.
https://content.historicengland.org.uk/remote/content.historicengland.org.uk/content/re...
This photo is from an impressive Report about the whole Forest of Dean based on aerial photography.
https://historicengland.org.uk/research/research-results/recent-research-results/south-...

The 166 page Report details the area's industrial history since ancient times until now (Scowles, quarrying, mining, iron-working etc) and even military sites from the World Wars, highly-recommended reading. It can be downloaded free-of-charge as a pdf file for easy searching etc, from here
https://historicengland.org.uk/images-books/publications/forest-of-dean-mapping-project...

More about Darkhill Furnaces here
https://sites.google.com/site/keithlloydwebb/forest-of-dean-articles-1/darkhill-iron-works
http://www.wyedeantourism.co.uk/discover/Things%20to%20do/i-4362-Dark_Hill_Iron_Works

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Hi there thanks for your reply. Yes I will go and look at ancestry at the library and look for him in the 1901 and 1911 census. They may have his son's attestation papers as well which may give me an address. Thank you for all the iInformation I will take time to look at it all. Thanks Euansma.

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Glad to help. I've used the Library Ancestry site myself to search out addresses rather than people and it usually works, just allow plenty of time and pick a quiet time of day if your library computer's are as slow as ours can be !, and preferably not evenings when Ancestry is extra busy from the USA. I can't remember if the Library system allows searches of GPO phone books etc as the subscription service will, this may help too.
Yes, thats a great idea searching young George's attestation papers, or indeed any other Pension forms etc, having researched many WW1 soldiers meself, I really should have thought of that.
Good luck with it and, if possible, please keep us advised of your findings; you probably guessed I'm always rather keen on any mechanical engineering posts !

atb J

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Hi again,
sadly my subscription for the British Newspaper Archive has just ended (I take out occasional trials when on special offer, last was £1/month!, so worth signing-up for the monthly newsletters...)
However anyone can still search for free, and get hints, I've just found this one which probably relates to your George hearing the terrible news about his son in France.

"COLEFORD SOLDIER.
Mr George Frowen, of Newland Street, Coleford, has received information from the War Office, that his son...."
Saturday 6 March 1915, Gloucestershire Chronicle" (and others)

You can search and find it yourself from here, set filters to "Gloucestershire" and search "George Frowen".
http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk

Please can someone with a BNA subscription consider looking this up in full, and maybe even downloading the image for Euansma, thanks.

Finally, re your Army enlistment papers suggestion, as I'm sure you know sometimes they have the address as per their home barracks, eg Bristol for the Gloster Regiment.

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There is not much more in the article. GR 1911 census confirms the address as 13 Newland Street, Coleford.

BNA Gloucestershire Chronicle - Saturday 06 March 1915

COLEFORD SOLDIERS

Mr. George Frowen, of Newland Street, Coleford, has received intimation from the War Office, that his son, Private George Frowen, of the 3rd Gloucester Regiment, was killed on February 3. Mr. Frowen had previously heard of his son’s death by letters of sympathy from comrades. Another son, Richard, is at present at home, having been wounded in the leg whilst fighting in the same regiment.

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Lloyd George Land Survey (1909)

http://www.glos1909survey.org.uk

GA/D2428/1/23/1 - Hereditament Number 317

Place: Coleford
Income tax parish: Coleford
Occupied by: FROWEN George (M)
Owned by: Miss, Parkend (F)
Property:
Description : house & garden
Address: Newland Street
Poor rate
Number: 341
Size: 14 perches
Gross Value: £5. 5s.
Rateable Value: £4
Comments: in 316

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Thanks for the last posts,just come back from looking up census and military info and so I know where he was and when, but still don't know where foundry house is. Maybe will remain a mystery, although modern adverts for taxis in Coleford give the address Foundry houses so will have to look in that area..Thanks for the lookup. Euansma

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I don’t know if it can possibly be related but there is this record of a house which might have been renamed or known by another name? According to property sites the house still exists but the Google cameras have not been past it.

BNA Gloucester Journal - Saturday 06 July 1912

DEATHS

RUSSELL—June 30th at Steel Works House, Milkwall, near Coleford, Sarah Russell, aged 69 years.

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Thanks for that I will have a look for it on some of the old maps.

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Thanks for that Mike, very helpful as ever.

Euansma, having already thoroughly studied the old maps it seems certain to me that the Steel Works House address can only relate to the buildings northwest of the Darkhill Furnace complex, as per my earlier post, they were labelled as "disused steel works" on the 1884 map and some buildings were still there on the later 1924 maps despite apparent encroaching from the quarry or similar, I also compared the maps to the modern Google Earth satellite imagery.

Re "Steel" as a place of residence, I've just used the Advanced Search looking for "Steel" in all this site's PRs for and cannot find any others in the Coleford area at all. Indeed I don't think we have Sarah's burial PR either.
However I was intrigued to see several PRs at a "Steel Works" address in Gorsley / Linton, an area I'd only ever associated with farming, yet there was an ironworks there four hundred years ago !
So yet again thanks to you guys and this great site for helping me learn !
http://htt.herefordshire.gov.uk/smrSearch/Monuments/Monument_Item.aspx?ID=23764

------------

A general web-search for "Steel Works House Milkwall" gave this super result.
http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Titanic_Steel_and_Iron_Co

As well as giving the name & history for the Steel Company which occupied the Darkhill site in the later years after Mushet until it closed in 1871, ie the "disused Steel works" shown on the maps. It also states the site was used for a brickworks until 1960, which explains the traces visible on the modern satellite photos.
Even better, the small photo at top right carries this text, which my search engine found;
"shows one of the few remaining works buildings and the former office building, now 'Steel Works Cottage', at the northern corner of the site."

Clicking the photo enlarges it thus, http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/File:JD_Titanic02.jpg

I can't speak from experience but I think (from the maps etc) the hill behind is Gorsty Knoll, to the east, and the photo is taken from the trackbed of the old S&W railway which runs north towards Milkwall Station/Tufthorn then onto Coleford. Hence as mentioned before Steel Works House is approx where this 1924 map shows buildings labelled "old quarry" and "Spr", but clearly cannot be sure without walking the site.
http://maps.nls.uk/view/102346004

As Mike says, it looks like this cottage may still exist in some form, needs a visit in person to be sure. Various sites quote "Steelworks Cottage, Gorsty Knoll, Coleford, Glos, GL16 7LR", but no photos, and unsure how big an area this postcode covers, prob not just one property.

I think this all perfectly confirms where Sarah Russell spent her final days...maybe some more work needs to be done researching her life, in case that ties-in with the Frowens, but this seems unlikely to me given the date of her Burial in 1912.

Given that the House was a different name and in a different era, I don't think this was George Frowen's last home, and I now think he was indeed living up the road, at Coalway Old Road, nearer his earlier recorded home in Coleford.
(see my next post)

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I've searched this site's PRs for all records containing the word "Foundry" as the "residence", using the Advanced Search facility. It will not search the PR notes as per George's Burial Record, sorry. As you might expect there are hits right across the Forest, especially Cinderford, also Redbrook, Bream, Lydney etc. In total there are 77 PRs quoting this "residence"; 34 Baptisms, 13 Marriages and 30 Burials. The majority are nowhere near Coleford area. NONE are in "Milkwall", but there are a few in Coalway, for completeness they're listed below.

Initial thought was these are most probably the same location the Taxis advertise from.

I then phoned my bro-in-law who's lived that area all his life, the last 35 years in Coalway. He wasn't certain but couldn't think of an obvious "Foundry House" in Milkwall. He does know the Coalway Soveriegn taxi address, and it's owner. He confirmed my guess (from the PR info) that Foundry Houses in Coalway Old Road is a typical FoD terrace of maybe 3 cottages, not an individual house as would perhaps befit a Foundry owner; more likely worker's houses, or maybe when built the only houses near a Foundry, so took the name. Worth looking on Google streetview if you're not in the area.
My brotherinlaw feels that even today's locals wouldn't consider Coalway and Milkwall to be the same locality; near neighbours maybe, but definitely separate villages & addresses clearly separated by a mile or so and a hill?, even more distinct 70 years ago.

It seems more than coincidence to me that most of the PRs for these few houses are all in the 1940s, and "busy" - were they rental lodgings. ?

Eitherway, I'm beginning to think that Coalway Old Road is indeed George Frewen's last home address, and the Vicar was maybe getting confused when writing the PR. Or, maybe, George was normally resident in Milkwall but actually died, perhaps after illness, with family or friend in Coalway => ambiguous PR entry ?. It's frustrating that I cannot find any evidence of a foundry in the Coalway area, but maybe it was there when the houses were built, and the name stuck ?

I have also searched thro some of the old Trade Directories from this list, hoping to find a relevant address entry for Milkwall or Coalway, but nothing found. See Coleford AND West Dean http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cbennett/

Similarly I searched my 1923 Kelly's Directory for Coleford without luck.

------------------------------

These are ALL the "Foundry" & "Coalway" residence records in this sites PRs;

Record_ID: 178696
Entry_Number: 3926
Year: 1945
Month: Mar
Day: 3
Surname: FROWEN
Forenames: George
Residence: Collier
Age_at_death: 83
Officiating_Minister: Rev[eren]d L V Wraith
Event: Interment
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda: (1) Foundry House Milkwall (2) Section A Adult Gr[ave] (3) N 25 (4) Consecrated (5) West Dean
Notes:
Register_Reference: DA25 / 204 / 30
Page_No: 96
Parish_Chapel: Coleford Cemetery
Soundex: F650

Record_ID: 1021518
Entry_Number: 28
Year: 1943
Month: Sep
Day: 14
Grooms_Surname: WEST
Grooms_Forenames: Henry Albert
Grooms_Age: 23
Groom_Condition: Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation: HM Forces
Grooms_Residence: Broadwell
Grooms_Fathers_Surname: WEST
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames: William Henry
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation: Electrical Engineer
Brides_Surname: ROOKE
Brides_Forenames: Muriel Bernice
Brides_Age: 19
Brides_Condition: Spinster
Brides_Occupation: Clerk
Brides_Residence: Foundry house Coalway
Brides_Fathers_Surname: ROOKE
Brides_Fathers_Forenames: Charles
Brides_Fathers_Occupation: Coal Hewer
Licence_or_Banns: Banns
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark: Both sign
Witness_1: Cecil Charles Ireland
Witness_2: Eileen Rooke
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister: Lawrence V.Wraith Vicar
Event: Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P93 IN 1/24
Page_Number: 14
Parish_Chapel: Coleford
Soundex_Groom: W230
Soundex_Bride: R200

Record_ID: 1022294
Entry_Number: 69
Year: 1945
Month: Jun
Day: 16
Grooms_Surname: NELSON
Grooms_Forenames: Albert
Grooms_Age: 25
Groom_Condition: Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation: H.M.Forces
Grooms_Residence: Silverdale Blugenfield Lane Darlaston
Grooms_Fathers_Surname: [not stated]
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames: [not stated]
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation: [not stated]
Brides_Surname: WALTHAM
Brides_Forenames: Irene Dorothy
Brides_Age: 20
Brides_Condition: Spinster
Brides_Occupation: H.M.Forces
Brides_Residence: Foundry Houses Coalway Coleford
Brides_Fathers_Surname: WALTHAM
Brides_Fathers_Forenames: Caleb Charles
Brides_Fathers_Occupation: Colliery Surface Worker
Licence_or_Banns: Licence
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark: Both sign
Witness_1: Ronald Frank Watkins
Witness_2: Ann Kathleen Waltham
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister: Ivan E.Holt Curate
Event: Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P93 IN 1/24
Page_Number: 35
Parish_Chapel: Coleford
Soundex_Groom: N425
Soundex_Bride: W435

Record_ID: 4351
Entry_Number: 584
Year: 1910
Month: Oct
Day: 13
Surname: ELLEY
Forenames: Richard Edward
Residence: Coalway Foundry House
Age_at_death: 7
Officiating_Minister: G A M Wynne Coleford
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P82 IN 1/15
Page_No: 75
Parish_Chapel: Christchurch
Soundex: E400

Luckily for me this Elley burial turns out to be my Coalway brother-in-law's maternal uncle !. I've only just started plotting that tree so haven't got much evidence as to how long they lived there, or who else was with them, all of which may have helped with George Frowen's story. Richard Elley Senior & sons were well-known Coalway miners over several generations. Many thanks Euansma for leading me onto this interesting PR which I'd not seen before, Richard Edward wasn't even on my tree as his short life "missed" the Censuses, and his siblings' PRs don't specifically mention Foundry House, just "Coalway".
If I do find anything else such as a Will, I'll update this thread.

So, to conclude, I now believe Coalway not Milkwall was probably George's last home. If you're in the area it would be nice to think the owner of the taxi firm might be able to help out too.
It might also be worth searching for George in the 1939 Register ??
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/1939-register/

Good luck !

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Hi Euansma,
shame you couldn't find Foundry House Milkwall in the Census', but worth a try.

Please see my note earlier re the modern addresses, yes the taxi firm at Coalway is not that far from Milkwall by modern standards, but it's still not the same address from an official GPO standpoint, and certainly not in years past when there was less housing so clearer demarcation between the 2 villages, but I agree it's worth considering, maybe the Minister got his address info mixed-up on George's burial record ?.

May I suggest you write an open letter for inclusion in The Forester newspaper, hopefully a reader will know or recall this address, or even George for that matter. Similarly if you happen to live locally a card in a shop window may bring rewards.

Thanks again Mike and MPG for your help too.

atb J

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I'm amazed that a brief search of Frowens killed in WW1, finding George jnr and then his father and realising he was one of my Frowens has led me to this search for a house which doesn't seem to exist, not in Milkwall anyway. Thank you Jefff for the info and the maps and to the other contributors who added flesh to bones.. Thanks Euansma.

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Forest of Dean FHT Forum

Foundry House, Milkwall (General)

Foundry House, Milkwall =>Iron works ? Darkhill ?

Foundry House, Milkwall =>Iron works ? Darkhill ?

Foundry House, Milkwall =>Iron works ? Darkhill ?

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => Steel Works House ?, probably not

Foundry House, Milkwall = Foundry Cottages Coalway, probably

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request

Foundry House, Milkwall => BNA newspaper lookup request