Forest of Dean FHT Forum - TOLLAND / HOLLAND ?

TOLLAND / HOLLAND ? (reply)

m p griffiths — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 16:06:47 +0000

On IGI

Elizabeth FOLLAND married William BARBER 11 April 1836 Bristol

This wedding certificate should yield more clues (hopefully)

There are a lot of FOLLAND's on the census from Great Torrington.

William BARBER 1816 Ostler (reply)

peter13 — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 14:28:19 +0000

Hi,
Makes perfect sense -I have always thought William was younger than his wife.
He and his sons were grooms,cab drivers etc so it would make sense that William's father was also involved with horses. Wonder if his father was a groom
or similar in France during the war.
My own grandpa was a groom in the first world war in France (my late dad's family).
You have certainly giving me a lot to ponder on.
Thanks so much.
Jackie

William BARBER 1816 Ostler (reply)

slowhands — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 12:27:09 +0000

"lights on" time

1811 is an unlikely year of birth for William - the later claim of around 1816 is more plausible

In 1811, William was alledgedly born in France during the period of Britsh-French Napoleonic war(s) 1803-1814 - Horses and Cavalry played an important part as did the Royal Navy, leading up to Waterloo in 1815.

The early offensives were in Egypt and the Iberian peninsula, Wellington's troops were probably not on French soil until late in the conflict.

I am aware that some wifes travelled with their soldier husbands so maybe ...

By 1816 Wellington's troops were still in France, and Louis XVIII was on the French throne. So a more probable time for William's birth in France

Somerset Military history
http://www.sommilmuseum.org.uk/

Gloster Military history
http://www.glosters.org.uk/

Tolland SOM (reply)

slowhands — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 12:12:43 +0000

Tolland village is not near Torrington Devon, but could easily be the "root" of this family

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/SOM/Tolland/index.html

"TOLLAND, a parish in the hundred of Taunton, county Somerset, 4 miles N.E. of Wiveliscombe, its post town, and 10 from Taunton.

TOLLAND / HOLLAND ? (reply)

peter13 — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 12:02:38 +0000

Hi,
The Birth cert is not clear -could be Holland(s) -Tolland(s) -Haleland!
Telephoned GRO -they have asked fot it to be returned as they feel it could be a bad copy!
Will let you know when I hear from them.
Thanks
J

TOLLAND / HOLLAND ? (reply)

slowhands — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 11:27:41 +0000

plenty of TOLLANDs from Dolton in the Torrington area

and
ELIZABETH HOLLAND

Birth:
Christening: 01 JUL 1810 Barnstaple, Devon, England

-----------------------------------------------
Parents:
Mother: ANN HOLLAND

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for locality listed in the record.
The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Source Information:
Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type: Printout Call No.: Type:
P005741 1538 - 1812 0962417 IT 1 Film 1145578 Film
Sheet: 00

infamous Grondra House at least in recent years
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/300790

http://www.freepressseries.co.uk/news/latestnews/3647059.Millionaire__defaced__his___2m...

Sarah Anne BARBER nee ALLEN 1839 Caldicot (reply)

peter13 — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 11:20:20 +0000

Hi slowhands!
Thank you so much.
William's son Henry as you can see ended up as an publican in Cardiff.
He was the start of the research -mum recently passed away and I came across his funeral card from 1904 (He was also Henry "Standerwick")most of his children were baptised at the Shirenewton Church- before he left the area he was listed as a policeman.
Sarah & Henry met whilst they were working at the famous "Grondra House"
Shirenewton.
The Birth cert has today arrived for Williams daughter Mary Ann 1849 -it's not very clear but it looks as if her mother was Elizabeth Hollands or Tollands
from Torrington -I hope this will bring me some luck tracing Williams parents.
thanks for all your help.
Jackie

Sarah Anne BARBER nee ALLEN 1839 Caldicot (reply)

slowhands — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 08:17:53 +0000

Caldicot Baptism

Date Year Surname ChildsName Father Mother Abode Occupation Notes
2 May 1830 Allen Betsy George Sarah Caldicot Village Labourer
10 Nov 1832 Allen Henry George Sarah Caldicot Labourer
11 Aug 1839 Allen Sarah Anne George Sarah Caldicot Labourer

1841
Sarah Morgan Allen abt 1771 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire
George Allen abt 1796 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Sarah Allen abt 1806 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Elizabeth Allen abt 1830 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Henry Allen abt 1833 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Sarah Allen abt 1840 Monmouthshire, Wales Caldicot, Monmouthshire

1851 nr Church
George Allen abt 1793 Caldicot, Monmouthshire, Wales Head Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Sarah Allen abt 1805 Bristol, Somerset, England Wife Caldicot, Monmouthshire
Sarah Allen abt 1840 Caldicot, Monmouthshire, Wales Daughter Caldicot, Monmouthshire
James Price abt 1813 Woolaston, Gloucestershire, England Lodger Caldicot, Monmouthshire

1861
Sarah Allen abt 1840 Caldicote, Monmouthshire, Wales Servant Shire Newton, Monmouthshire

1861
Henry Barber abt 1843 Bristol Servant Shire Newton, Monmouthshire

Name: Sarah Ann Allen
Name: Henry Barber
Year of Registration: 1861
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Newport M
County: Glamorgan, Gwent, Monmouthshire
Volume: 11a
Page: 254

1871 Shirenewton Village nr School
Henry Barber 39 Groom
Sarah Barber 30
Elizabeth Barber 8
Lucy Barber 5
Henry Barber 3
Eva Barber 1

1881 back of St Mary St Theatre
Henry Barber abt 1842 Bristol, Gloucestershire, England Head Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan Groom
Sarah A. Barber abt 1841 Calcot Wife Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
Elizabeth Barber abt 1864 Shirenewton Daughter Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
Henry S. Barber . abt 1868 Shirenewton Son Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
Eva A. Barber abt 1870 Shirenewton Daughter Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
Emily Barber abt 1875 Shirenewton Daughter Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
William Barber. abt 1877 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Son Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan
Mary Louisa Barber abt 1880 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Daughter Cardiff St Mary, Glamorgan

1891 "Marchioness of Bute" Sophia St
Henry Barber abt 1842 Bristol, Gloucestershire, England Head St Mary, Glamorgan
Sarah A Barber abt 1841 Caldicote, Monmouthshire, Wales Wife St Mary, Glamorgan
Henry S Barber abt 1869 Shienerston, Monmouthshire, Wales Son St Mary, Glamorgan
William J S Barber abt 1877 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Son St Mary, Glamorgan
Mary L Barber abt 1880 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Daughter St Mary, Glamorgan
George O Barber abt 1882 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Son St Mary, Glamorgan

1901
Henry Berber Sarah A abt 1840 Bristol, Somerset, England Head St Mary, Glamorgan
Sarah A Berber Henry abt 1840 Caldicot, Monmouthshire, Wales Wife St Mary, Glamorgan
Mary L Bennett abt 1880 Cardiff, Glamorgan, Wales Daughter St Mary, Glamorgan

Coach and Horses Inn Chepstow (reply)

peter13 — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 06:41:52 +0000

I would say in all probability this could well be the Inn-William ran.
Thanks
J

William Standerwick Barber b 1811 (reply)

peter13 — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 06:36:29 +0000

Thanks for the ideas-so far there has been no trace of a marriage in Devon
-I'm hoping that when there childs birth cert arrives I may get a lead.
By 1842 the family had left Compton Bishop and were in Bristol.There son Henry was christened 2/1/1842 Bristol Glocs.
Today I will see if I can trace Sarah Cower(census 1841.
J

Coach and Horses Inn Chepstow (reply)

slowhands — Thu, 27 Aug 2009 05:43:48 +0000

< no proof , but this is a probable employer for William Barber in the 1860's>

Coach and Horses Inn
Welsh Street,
Chepstow,
NP16 5LN

This 16th century coaching house is situated on Welsh Street in the rural Welsh boarder town of Chepstow

http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/1415480

http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/474886

William Standerwick Barber b 1811 (reply)

m p griffiths — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 21:05:32 +0000

Peter

Have you traced the marriage of William BARBER to Elizabeth ? born Torington, Devon c1811 - the marriage certificate would have his father's name if it took place September Qtr 1837 onwards , or at least witness names pre September 1837

The Gloucestershire Marriage Index may help

Their first born William (age 4) c1837 on the 1841 census - age 13 c1838 on the 1851 census, born Bristol.

There is a 'lodger' with William and Elizabeth (1841) Sarah COWER? age 70

Probably a 'red herring' but .....

On the 1851 census, for Junction Street, Coventry, there is a Joseph BARBER age 57 (watch case springer) born Coventry, and Hannah his wife age 58, British Subject, born Valencis....... France

Standerwick SOM (reply)

peter13 — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 20:56:55 +0000

Hi slowhands-this could prove interesting.
From what I have gathered so far this branch of the family were firstly horse
keepers/dealers or cab/coach drivers -all seemed to go on to run Inns.I have ordered a birth certificate for one of Williams children with the hope of tracing Williams wife's maiden name.
The interesting part is he came to be born in France.
Will put a post up if I get any answers.
Thanks.
J

Standerwick SOM (reply)

peter13 — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:06:47 +0000

Many Thanks for your help.
Jackie

Standerwick SOM (reply)

slowhands — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:03:30 +0000

I suspect you will find plenty of Barber's in the Frome SOM area and maybe -

A.J & R.G Barber Ltd
Maryland Farm
Shepton Mallet
BA4 6PR

The Barber family have been farming and in Somerset since the early 1800´s. Initially the milk was sold from the farm and cheese was just made to feed the family and farm workers. As time passed it proved more beneficial to make cheese than to sell milk and soon Barbers were buying milk from other nearby farms as well as using all their own milk to make cheese.

In the 1950´s as a result of family links with Wales, manufacture concentrated heavily on producing Caerphilly wheels for the Welsh mining community (Caerphilly held its condition underground better than other foods). Today the company has returned to producing West Country Farmhouse Cheddar, which is the focus of the business, and has continued to expand the farm along side, which now includes milking around 1700 dairy cows.

Standerwick SOM (reply)

peter13 — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 15:40:03 +0000

Thanks for the information -I'm wondering now if the Barber family may have
lived in Standerwick 1700's.
I will see if I can trace any "Barber's" to the area.
Once again many thanks.
J

Standerwick SOM (reply)

slowhands — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 15:30:56 +0000

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/SOM/Standerwick/index.html

"STANDERWICK, a parish in the hundred of Frome, county Somerset, 4 miles N.E. of Frome. Beckington is its post town. The village, which is small, is wholly agricultural. The parish includes Old Ford. The land is chiefly in pasture. The living is a rectory annexed to that of Beckington, in the diocese of Bath and Wells. Mrs. Edgell, of Standerwick Court, is lady of the manor and principal landowner. There are remains of an ancient encampment." From The National Gazetteer of Great Britain and Ireland (1868) Transcribed by Colin Hinson © 2003

not that far to

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/SOM/ComptonBishop/index.html

COMPTON BISHOP, a parish in the hundred of Winterstoke, in the county of Somerset, 2 miles W. of Axbridge, its post town, and 11 from the Yatton railway station. It is pleasantly situated at the foot of the Mendip hills,

William BARBER 1811 Ostler ? (reply)

peter13 — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 15:05:53 +0000

Thanks slowhands -yes that is gg grandpa.
1841 he was living in Compton Bishop
1851 his wife and children were at Chepstow.His wife died 1854.
1861 he was living in Welch St Chepstow -horse dealer
1868 he died at Chepstow occupation Inn Keeper
The children by then had moved to Ross-Shirenewton etc.
The big puzzle is this middle name Standerwick -obviously had family meaning because it's followed through to my uncle but we have no idea why.
Jackie

William BARBER 1816- 1868 Ostler ? (reply)

slowhands — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 13:59:49 +0000

Is this him ?

1851
William Barber abt 1811 France Lodger Newnham, Gloucestershire Ostler (?)

Ostler
A person employed at an inn, hostelry, or stable to look after horses; a groom

I see what you mean

Name: William Standawick Barber
Year of Registration: 1909
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Cardiff (1837-1974)
County: Glamorgan, Monmouthshire
Volume: 11a
Page: 445

< added >
1841
William Barber abt 1816 Compton Bishop, Somerset Horse Keeper
Elizabeth Barber abt 1811 Compton Bishop, Somerset
William Barber abt 1837 Compton Bishop, Somerset
Elizabeth Barber abt 1840 Somerset, England Compton Bishop, Somerset

1851 Welsh St
Elizabeth Barber abt 1811 Torington, Devon, England Head Chepstow, Monmouthshire
William Barber abt 1838 Bristol Son Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Elizabeth Barber abt 1840 Compton Brishap, Somerset, England Daughter Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Henry Barber abt 1842 Bristol Son Chepstow, Monmouthshire
James Barber abt 1845 Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales Son Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Thomas Barber abt 1847 Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales Son Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Mary Ann Barber abt 1850 Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales Daughter Chepstow, Monmouthshire

1861
William Barber abt 1816 Fra British Subject Head Chepstow, Monmouthshire Ostler
Elizabeth Barber abt 1840 Compton Bishop, Somerset, England Servant Chepstow, Monmouthshire
James Barber abt 1845 Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales Son Chepstow, Monmouthshire
Maryann Barber abt 1850 Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales Daughter Chepstow, Monmouthshire

Name: William Standerwick Barber
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Year of Registration: 1868
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Age at Death: 52
District: Chepstow
County: Gloucestershire, Monmouthshire
Volume: 11a
Page: 5

William Standerwick Barber b 1811

peter13 — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:48:21 +0000

Hi Everyone,
GG Grandpa William Standerwick Barber was born around 1811 France(British Subject)
He lived in several areas -settled and died in Welsh St Chepstow.
His children lived in Ross-Shirenewton and several arrived in Cardiff around 1880. Several of the sons and their children had the middle name "Standerwick"
which has followed through to present time.
I can see no marriage to a Standerwick or any trace of the family coming from Standerwick.
I hope that it may help trace the family prior to 1811.
Any ideas or suggestions please.
J