Forest of Dean FHT Forum - Parents of Ann James, baptised 21 November 1703, St Briavels

Parents of Ann James, baptised 21 November 1703, St Briavels (reply)

ElimaG — Wed, 22 May 2019 19:28:44 +0000

Thank you so much. I assume these must be the parents of Ann James (b. 1703) rather than James James (b. 1677) and Elizabeth.
Best wishes,
Elima

Parents of Ann James, baptised 21 November 1703, St Briavels (reply)

admin — Wed, 22 May 2019 18:34:59 +0000

We have looked at the image of the original on Ancestry and agree that the mother's forename is Cybell and the database has been updated.
As for parentage there is the following marriage:

Year 1699
Month Dec
Day
Grooms Surname JAMES
Grooms Forenames James
Grooms Age
Groom Condition
Grooms Occupation
Grooms Residence Chapel Hill Mon.
Grooms Fathers Surname
Grooms Fathers Forenames
Grooms Fathers Occupation
Brides Surname LLOYD
Brides Forenames Sibella
Brides Age
Brides Condition
Brides Occupation
Brides Residence St Briavels
Brides Fathers Surname
Brides Fathers Forenames
Brides Fathers Occupation
Licence or Banns
Date of Banns
Signature or Mark
Witness 1
Witness 2
Other Witnesses
Officiating Minister
Event Marriage
Memoranda
Notes In this record the forename of the bride was not clear so best guess given
Register Reference
Page Number
Parish Chapel Chapel Hill Monmouth

Chapel Hill is a short distance from St Briavels which is the residence of the bride.

Parents of Ann James, baptised 21 November 1703, St Briavels

ElimaG — Wed, 22 May 2019 18:12:10 +0000

Hello - I'm new to this forum and would be very grateful for any help that more experienced researchers can give me.
One of my ancestors, Ann James, was baptised at St Briavels on 21 November 1703 and married Thomas Evans at English Bicknor in 1721. The record of Ann's baptism (which I found on Ancestry) is a transcription of the original records from St Briavels' Chapel - the transcriber says so at the top of the manuscript.
This 17th century transcription gives Ann's parents' names as 'James James and Cybell his wife'. NB in the parish records section on this website, the wife's name is given as 'Sybell', but the original manuscript definitely says 'Cybell'.
I wonder if Ann may actually have been the daughter of James James (born in 1677 at St Briavels, son of Richard James) and Elizabeth Jones (born 1679 in Newland) and that whoever transcribed the mother's name (all the way back in the 17th century) misread 'Elizabeth' as 'Cybell'. If you write the name by hand using old letter forms, it's easy to see how the scrawled name may have been misread. I've seen this sort of mistake in other old parish records. (I wonder if the original St Briavels Chapel records still exist?)
One researcher on Ancestry says that Ann's father was a different James James, baptised in St Briavels in 1670 (who is in the parish records - the son of Robert and Jane James) and that her mother was a Sibella Lloyd. She says this couple married in Chapel Hill, Monmouthshire in 1699. But I can't find any mention of them in Forest of Dean records. Also, she gives Sibella Lloyd's year of birth as 1650, which would make her 53 when Ann was born.
The date of Ann's birth, if she is the daughter of the James James born in 1677 and his wife Elizabeth, would fit her neatly into a gap between her siblings.
I also have some DNA evidence for this (through my DNA matches on Ancestry who are descended from James James (b. 1677) and Elizabeth Jones and don't seem to be related to me in any other way).
I'd very much appreciate your thoughts on this.
Best wishes
Elima