but beyond that I too am no further forward at finding out what happened to Eliza Poyner

His abode is often recorded as May Hill but latterly as Taynton. When I was growing up in Newent that whole area, including Taynton, May Hill Village, Longhope and Huntley was frequently referred to simply as May Hill so the designation isn’t definitive.

No-one has anything good to say about him. He is variously described as lazy, indolent, disgusting, disorderly, a liar and a hypocrite. Crimes include vagrancy, theft, trespass and absconding from the workhouse. He has a number of convictions for refusing to work at the Newent Union.

In more than one record he is recorded as being married to an Eliza BARNARD although another gives his wife as May A BARNAR?. This is at variance with the Glos. Archives workhouse records where, whenever mentioned, he is recorded as single. It is also at variance with a possible marriage at Taynton to Maria SPENCER in 1827 although I cannot find any children of this marriage or any definite trace of a Maria BARNARD thereafter. An Eliza BARNARD is recorded on this site as being buried at Taynton,

Record_ID 44202
Entry_Number 710
Year 1885
Month Apr
Day 6
Surname BARNARD
Forenames Eliza
Residence Mayhill Taynton
Age_at_death 66 years
Officiating_Minister Alfred Drake Bagshawe Rector
Event Burial
Cause_of_death
Memoranda
Notes
Register_Reference P326 IN 1/9
Page_No 89
Parish_Chapel Taynton

No traceable marriage though.

Just to confuse things further one of the prison entries from Ancestry gives him an alias and says he has a child,

Littledean House of Correction
Date of Admission: Aug 13 1849
Prisoner’s Number in Index: 1093
Name: Richard BARNETT alias BARNARD
Late residence and trade: May Hill, Hurdle Maker
Age: 43
Height 5’ ?’’
Hair: Carroty?
Eyes: Hazle
Visage: Round
Complexion: Fresh
Other Marks: None
Cause of commitment: Damage on 19 July 1849 at the Parish of Tainton. Wilfully commit damage to and upon certain Under Wood – property of John PROBYN.
By whom committed: R.F Onslow Esq.
Sentence passed: One Cal Month hard labour or pay 13/6 fine for damage and 7/6 costs.
Expiration of term: 13 Sep
When discharged or removed: 13 Sep
By what authority: Served his time
Previously known character, habits and connexions: A married man with one child. A very indolent? man.
Convicted before and how often: 4 times
Conduct in prison: Good

I am sure he must be the same Richard BARNARD recorded frequently as admitted or discharged from Newent Union Workhouse by Gloucestershire Archives. The consistent association with Taynton makes me favour him as the Richard BARNARD associated with Elizabeth POYNER. However, this still takes me no further with Elizabeth herself.

The other candidate might be this one,

Record_ID 392110
Entry_Number
Year 1807
Month Dec
Day 20
Parents_Surname BARNARD
Child_Forenames Richard
Fathers_Forenames Thomas
Mothers_Forenames Lettice
Mothers_Surname
Residence
Occupation
Officiating_Minister
Event Baptism
Memoranda
Notes
Register_Reference P206 IN 1/3
Page_Number 129
Parish_Chapel Longhope

I have had no success tracking him.

I now have copies of a couple more documents which look to be associated with Elizabeth POYNER:-

The registration of the birth of Charles POYNER occurred in the District of Huntley on March 20th 1839. The date of birth was March 12th 1839 and the place was Westbury. The mother was Elizabeth POYNER and the informant was Thomas HARVEY, Master of the Westbury Union Workhouse.

The death of the Elizabeth POYNER , buried at Gloucester St Catherine, took place on 27th August 1843 and was registered on 30th August 1843 in the District of St Nicholas. Her occupation was a charwoman and her age is given as 28. The cause of death was dropsy and the informant was Deborah WOODWARD (who marked), occupier, 13 Park Street.

The first registration allows me to construct a reasonable scenario. Elizabeth has her first illegitimate child, Eliza, in 1835. Eliza’s father was James PARRY, mason, of Blaisdon, but they do not marry. Both Elizabeth and Eliza remain with Elizabeth’s father, Edward POYNER in Huntley. In October 1838 the banns of marriage between Elizabeth and Charles COLE are published at Huntley. Elizabeth is already pregnant at this time. Charles realises or finds out that the child is not his and calls off the marriage. Elizabeth is disown by her father, Edward, and cannot, for some reason, go to the house of the real father of the child, Richard BARNARD. She does the only other thing open to her which is to go to the workhouse at Westbury (Huntley was in Westbury’s patch) where Charles POYNER is born in March 1839. The Master of the Workhouse registers the birth whilst in Huntley and Charles is baptised at Westbury in early April. Sometime later Elizabeth and Charles return to Taynton to the house of Richard BARNARD where Charles dies in October 1839.

it has taken me a while to get back to this after my holiday.... and a while to get my head around it.

if baby Charles is not the son of Charles Cole why would Elizabeth call him Charles? unless she was hoping that Charles Cole changed his mind about marrying her of course.

do we have two Richard Barnards both born around 1806? I have found a Richard who married Maria Spencer 1 Aug 1827 in Taynton.... but no other info about them.... just the 1851 census where he is living with his brother-in-law and sister Pheobe in Barton St Michael

and I've found a Richard Barnard also born around 1806 who always seems to be in prison for begging and vagrancy (sad) .................. are they the same person?

Level Piece
Alt Ref No G/NE/60/1 (part)
Title Entry in Newent workhouse register of admissions and discharges for admission of Richard Barnard, aged 33, admitted on 28 November 1838
Date 1838
Description Religious persuasion: Church of England
Chargeable to: Taynton
Admitted on the authority of: Robt Bruton

This is the first of many admissions and discharges at the Newent Union Workhouse for Richard BARNARD of Taynton. Most imply a birth date of 1805/6 although there are a couple of anomalous ones which imply a birth date of 1786 – I can find no record of the birth of a Richard Barnard at this time. The first group are 1838 to 1844 where he is variously described as a woodman or a vagrant. On his discharge 31/10/1842 it is recorded that he was sent to Littledean Prison. There is a second group in 1857 where he is described as destitute. The third group is 1870 to 1877 where he is described as a labourer. The last discharge is 19/09/1877 when he died. He is usually described as single and able-bodied. Some of the earlier admission authorities are by William BRUTON who was the local Registar and who registered the death of Charles POYNER in November 1839.

FODFHT

Record_ID: 44150
Entry_Number: 658
Year: 1877
Month: Sep
Day: 24
Surname: BARNARD
Forenames: Richard
Residence: Newent Union
Age_at_death: 71 years
Officiating_Minister: Alfred D Bagshawe Rector
Event: Burial
Cause_of_death:
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference: P326 IN 1/9
Page_No: 83
Parish_Chapel: Taynton

GR 1841 Census, Gloucester, St Catherine, St Catherine’s (Knap? Keep?)

George WOODWARD, 45, Side Waiter (Customs?), born in County
Deborah, 45, born in County

Provided things have not changed drastically this is all close to the Cathedral and to Park Street where Deborah WOODWARD lived at the time of the 1843 registration of the death of Elizabeth POYNER.

There was another Elizabeth POYNER living in the same area in the 1841 but I can show that this is the wife of Robert POYNER, a servant, of Taynton, working in College Precinct at that time. This Elizabeth (nee HOLTHAM/HOLTOM) died in 1847. If I can establish a link (other than the death registration) between Deborah WOODWARD and Elizabeth POYNER (buried 1843) I will be home and dry.

Elizabeth was living at St Catherine's

1841 Census : St Catherine Knap

WOODWARD

George - 45-49 all born Gloucestershire
Dorotha - 45-49
William HENSLEY - 35-39
Jane HENSLEY - 30-34
William HENSLEY - 7
Mary Jane HENSLEY - 4 (Family Search, christened 27 November 1836, Saint Mary Major, Exter, Devon)

Looking at the map - the last house appears to be 17B - just a couple of doors away is Park Street Mission Rooms (In 1867 the Park Street Mission was established in the former Quaker Meeting House).

??
On the 1851 Census

Deborah WOODWARD (with husband George) aged 60 occupation given as Almswoman.

Gloucestershire Burial Index CD

Deborah WOODWARD aged 61: 23 October 1851

residence: St Mary Magdalene Hospital

buried

Gloucester St Mary Magdalene

---

FoD records

Marriage at St Mary de Crypt - 19 March 1813

George WOODWARD/Deborah NIBLETT

The registration of the birth of Charles POYNER occurred in the District of Huntley on March 20th 1839. The date of birth was March 12th 1839 and the place was Westbury. The mother was Elizabeth POYNER and the informant was Thomas HARVEY, Master of the Westbury Union Workhouse.

The death of the Elizabeth POYNER , buried at Gloucester St Catherine, took place on 27th August 1843 and was registered on 30th August 1843 in the District of St Nicholas. Her occupation was a charwoman and her age is given as 28. The cause of death was dropsy and the informant was Deborah WOODWARD (who marked), occupier, 13 Park Street.

The first registration allows me to construct a reasonable scenario. Elizabeth has her first illegitimate child, Eliza, in 1835. Eliza’s father was James PARRY, mason, of Blaisdon, but they do not marry. Both Elizabeth and Eliza remain with Elizabeth’s father, Edward POYNER in Huntley. In October 1838 the banns of marriage between Elizabeth and Charles COLE are published at Huntley. Elizabeth is already pregnant at this time. Charles realises or finds out that the child is not his and calls off the marriage. Elizabeth is disown by her father, Edward, and cannot, for some reason, go to the house of the real father of the child, Richard BARNARD. She does the only other thing open to her which is to go to the workhouse at Westbury (Huntley was in Westbury’s patch) where Charles POYNER is born in March 1839. The Master of the Workhouse registers the birth whilst in Huntley and Charles is baptised at Westbury in early April. Sometime later Elizabeth and Charles return to Taynton to the house of Richard BARNARD where Charles dies in October 1839.

The second registration does not get me much further and I am still not 100% sure this is the Elizabeth POYNER I’m looking for. The age is not quite right but is within possible variation.

There is still no trace of a burial PR for Charles POYNER and no suitable adult burials in the immediate area with which he could have been included. I wonder where he is.

I have now obtained the death registration for Charles POYNER (bap. 1839). It gives the information that the death took place on 31st October, 1839, in Taynton. The age at death was 7 months and the cause was a convulsive fit. The informant was a Richard BARNARD, Occupier, Present at the Death, Taynton. Taynton was, of course, in Newent Registation Distrct.

This information about Richard BARNARD is quite easy to find but where it gets me is a bit more difficult. The POYNERs certainly had links to Taynton.

those BARNARD people keep turning up! :-)

This information about Richard BARNARD is quite easy to find but where it gets me is a bit more difficult. The POYNERs certainly had links to Taynton.

FODFHT

Record_ID 231786
Entry_Number
Year 1806
Month Jun
Day 22
Parents_Surname BARNARD
Child_Forenames Richard
Fathers_Forenames William
Mothers_Forenames Phoeby
Mothers_Surname
Residence
Occupation
Officiating_Minister R Foley
Event baptism
Memoranda
Notes Will extended to William
Register_Reference P326 IN 1/4
Page_Number 6
Parish_Chapel Taynton

Record_ID 17067
Entry_Number 34
Year 1827
Month Aug
Day 1
Grooms_Surname BARNARD
Grooms_Forenames Richard
Grooms_Age
Groom_Condition Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation
Grooms_Residence of this parish
Grooms_Fathers_Surname
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation
Brides_Surname SPENCER
Brides_Forenames Maria
Brides_Age
Brides_Condition Spinster
Brides_Occupation
Brides_Residence of this parish
Brides_Fathers_Surname
Brides_Fathers_Forenames
Brides_Fathers_Occupation
Licence_or_Banns Banns
Date_of_Banns
Signature_or_Mark Both sign
Witness_1 Mark of Thomas Russell
Witness_2 Phebe Russell
Other_Witnesses
Officiating_Minister James Archibald Off[iciatin]g Minister
Event Marriage
Memoranda
Notes
Register_Reference P326 IN 1/8
Page_Number 12
Parish_Chapel Taynton

GR 1851 Census, 15, Hampden Place, Gloster

Thomas RUSSELL, Head, Mar, 49, Groom and Labourer, b. Gloster
Phoebe, Wife, Mar, 54, Lodging House Keeper, Taynton, Glostershire
Richard BARNARD, Brother-in-law, Mar, 44, , Taynton, Glostershire

FODFHT

Record_ID 321017
Entry_Number
Year 1793
Month Jun
Day 16
Parents_Surname BARNARD
Child_Forenames Phoebe
Fathers_Forenames William
Mothers_Forenames Phoebe
Mothers_Surname
Residence Taynton
Occupation
Officiating_Minister J Morse Rector
Event Baptism
Memoranda
Notes
Register_Reference P184 IN 1/2
Page_Number 12
Parish_Chapel Huntley

At Walford - 9 November 1833

Robert PINER or POYNER - John & Eliza had a Son John.

In previous thread

1841 census

PYNER

Edward 60
Eliza 4 (which is your line)

There are PINER/PYNER records on the site which includes Huntley

?

baptism at Monmouth

21 Jane 1849

Alfred PINER, mother Elizabeth, residence: Monmouth Union

Charles POYNER - christened at Westbury on Severn - 7 April 1839 - mother: Elizabeth, single woman

and on Gloucestershirebmd

Death

Charles POYNER - aged 7 m Gloucester Newent 1839

Elizabeth POYNER is my OH's 3x great grandmother

I now think that the Elizabeth POYNER buried at Gloucester St Catherine on August 31st 1843 must be her. She’s the only real candidate.

atb Mike

Michael

You could go onto the Home Page on this forum; under the heading 'The Trust' - drop down to either

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to ask for them to check the Huntley Marriage records for 1838 to clarify whether or not the marriage information is in Huntley parish records.

I am sure James GREEN was the father of Thomas GREEN (later the husband of Eliza POYNER. He married Esther (or Hester) BROOKE in 1823. However, I had no information about Elizabeth's sister so thanks for that.

What puzzles me is the FamilySearch record of Elizabeth's marriage to Charles COLE I have looked for her as Elizabeth COLE but there seems to be nothing clearly identifiable.

Elizabeth POYNER - age 28 (31 August 1843) Gloucester St Catherine

---

Obviously Elizabeth's mother wasn't around on the 1841 census with her daughter.

Elizabeth POYNER - christened 29 June 1817 at Huntley, parents Edward (labourer) & Ann

1841 census, Huntley

PYNER

Edward - 60
Eliza - 4

----

Fod records

Mary POINTER (Spinster) married John JOHNSON (Bachelor) ** (Elizabeth's sister)

30 September 1834, at Gloucester St Mary de lobe

GlosBDM - JOHNSON - mother's maiden name POYNER - - Huntley - James - 1844 and Mary Ann - 1842

Looking at the 1841 census -

James GREEN - 50 (father of Thomas? - who later married Elizabeth POYNER)
Hester - 40
Robert - 7
Eliza - 5
Confort - 2
Francis - 6 months

** next door

John JOHNSON - 30
Mary - 30
Edward - 5
Elizabeth - 3