Memoranda Baptism of John Charles Webb Philpot 12 Apr 1914 (General)

by bexjarratt @, Sunday, September 11, 2011, 15:27 (4829 days ago)

Hi,

I'm researching my family tree, and this website is such a help as most of my grandfathers side of the family lived in Ruardean and adjacent settlements for very many generations.

There is an unusual memoranda note on the above record which reads "Parents Albert Williams born 28/11/14". Can anyone suggest what it may mean?

It may be useful to know that John CW PHILPOTS mothers maiden name was Williams.

Many thanks for any advice you may have on this intreging snippit of information.

Rebecca Jarratt.

Memoranda Baptism of John Charles Webb Philpot 12 Apr 1914

by Jefff @, West London, Middlesex, Sunday, September 11, 2011, 15:42 (4829 days ago) @ bexjarratt

Record_ID: 118264
Entry_Number: 424
Year: 1914
Month: Apr
Day: 12
Parents_Surname: PHILPOT
Child_Forenames: John Charles Webb
Fathers_Forenames: Leopold Archer
Mothers_Forenames: Liby
Mothers_Surname:
Residence: West End Ruardean
Occupation: Collier Weightman
Officiating_Minister: G A Hopkins
Event: Baptism
Memoranda: Parents Albert Williams born 28/11/14
Notes:
Register_Reference: 20812
Page_Number: 53
Parish_Chapel: Lydbrook
Soundex: P413

Hi Rebecca, hope its not too windy where you are ?.
As you probably know there doesn't appear to be a Baptism Record for Albert Williams on this site. I cannot find him on GlosBMD or FreeBMD either.

I would normally associate such a memoranda note as an indicator from the Minister that the child being baptised is born "out of wedlock", with the true father being Albert Williams. However, in such an instance the Baptism Record wouldn't have normally named the Child's Father (Leopold Archer). Unusually (at least in my limited experience) the note names another child entirely from that being Baptised, and to make things curiouser & curiouser refers to a later event than the actual Baptism. I can only assume the note was a later addendum ?.

Using the Advanced Search gives the following family group:

118264 1914 PHILPOT John Charles Webb, Leopold Archer & Liby, West End Ruardean, Collier Weightman, Lydbrook
1032718 1917 PHILPOT Margaret Ivy, Archer Leopold & Lily, Ruardean, Miner, Ruardean
1032719 1917 PHILPOT Joan Edith, Archer Leopold & Lily, Ruardean, Miner, Ruardean

I can only wonder if this couple had "adopted" Albert Williams as well, does the name appear later in your tree at all ?

I've searched this site for this Albert Williams within the later Marriage Records, but all the possible one's I've found c1938 onwards clearly show a logical Groom's father and not Leopold etc.

The later Baptisms are:

Record ID 1032718
Entry Number 9
Year 1917
Month Feb
Day 22
Parents Surname PHILPOT
Child Forenames Margaret Ivy
Fathers Forenames Archer Leopold
Mothers Forenames Lily
Mothers Surname
Residence Ruardean
Occupation Miner
Officiating Minister E Parnell Rector
Event Baptism
Memoranda Privately Baptized
Notes
Register Reference P275 IN 1/25
Page Number 2
Parish Chapel Ruardean

Record ID 1032719
Entry Number 10
Year 1917
Month Feb
Day 22
Parents Surname PHILPOT
Child Forenames Joan Edith
Fathers Forenames Archer Leopold
Mothers Forenames Lily
Mothers Surname
Residence Ruardean
Occupation Miner
Officiating Minister E Parnell Rector
Event Baptism
Memoranda Privately Baptized Christened April 9
Notes
Register Reference P275 IN 1/25
Page Number 2
Parish Chapel Ruardean

I wonder if the reason the above baptisms were "Private", and at a different Chapel than before, was due to some social reason / peer pressure perhaps wrt Albert ?

Memoranda Baptism of John Charles Webb Philpot 12 Apr 1914

by bexjarratt @, Saturday, September 17, 2011, 23:59 (4822 days ago) @ Jefff

Thanks for your help, I think I will need to dig much further before this becomes clear. I'll post back when or if I get to the bottom of it.

I think the reason for Margaret and Joan's Baptisms being private might have been because Margaret was sick, there's a burial record for her within a year. There's also a christening record at the chapel for Joan just a couple of months after the private one.

John Charles Webb PHILPOT 28 Feb 1914 - 1998

by slowhands @, proud of his ancient Dean Forest roots, Monday, September 19, 2011, 18:04 (4821 days ago) @ bexjarratt

Memoranda: Parents Albert Williams born 28/11/14

The 28/November was puzzling me, but now it is clear that the II is roman numerals for month 2 i.e. Feb.
I wonder if Albert Williams is Lily Williams brother and named as a God-parent ?

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Year:1892
Month:Aug
Day:7
Parents_Surname:WILLIAMS
Child_Forenames:Lily
Fathers_Forenames:John
Mothers_Forenames:Selina
Mothers_Surname:
Residence:Pluds
Occupation:Labourer
Officiating_Minister:W E Seaver
Event:Baptism
Memoranda:Born 1 Jan 1890
Notes:
Register_Reference:P275 IN 1/8
Page_Number:59
Parish_Chapel:Ruardean


1881
John T. Philpot abt 1843 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Head Ruardean, Gloucestershire
Julia Philpot abt 1852 Weston, Hereford, England Wife Ruardean, Gloucestershire
Thomas Philpot abt 1874 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Son Ruardean, Gloucestershire
Georgina Philpot abt 1876 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter Ruardean, Gloucestershire
John Philpot abt 1880 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Son Ruardean, Gloucestershire

1891
John T Philpot abt 1843 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Head Ruardean, Gloucestershire
Georgenia Philpot abt 1876 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter Ruardean, Gloucestershire
John C Philpot abt 1879 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Son Ruardean, Gloucestershire
Leopold A Philpot abt 1888 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Son Ruardean, Gloucestershire


1901
John Thomas abt 1843 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Head Ruardean, Herefordshire
Leopold Actice Philpott abt 1888 Ruardean, Gloucestershire, England Son Ruardean, Herefordshire


1901
John Williams abt 1859 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Head East Dean, Gloucestershire
Selina Williams abt 1857 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Wife East Dean, Gloucestershire
Kate Williams abt 1885 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter East Dean, Gloucestershire
Charlie Williams abt 1888 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Son East Dean, Gloucestershire
Lily Williams abt 1890 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter East Dean, Gloucestershire
Beatrice Williams abt 1893 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter East Dean, Gloucestershire
Edith Williams abt 1895 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Daughter East Dean, Gloucestershire
Albert Williams abt 1896 East Dean, Gloucestershire, England Son East Dean, Gloucestershire


Name: Leopold A Philpot
Spouse : Lily Williams

Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1913
Registration district: Monmouth
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume Number: 11a
Page Number: 52

Groom Surname Groom Forename
Bride Surname Bride Forename
District Parish Building Year Register Entry

PHILPOT Leopold Archer
WILLIAMS Lily
Forest of Dean Lydbrook Holy Jesus 1913 1 346


Year:1913
Month:Mar
Day:24
Grooms_Surname:PHILPOT
Grooms_Forenames:Leopold Archer
Grooms_Age:25
Groom_Condition:Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation:Weighman
Grooms_Residence:Ruardean
Grooms_Fathers_Surname: PHILPOT
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames:John (deceased)
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation:Farmer
Brides_Surname:WILLIAMS
Brides_Forenames:Lily
Brides_Age:23
Brides_Condition:Spinster
Brides_Occupation:
Brides_Residence:Lydbrook
Brides_Fathers_Surname:WILLIAMS
Brides_Fathers_Forenames:John
Brides_Fathers_Occupation:Collier
Licence_or_Banns:Banns
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark:both sign
Witness_1:John Williams
Witness_2:Gladys Harper
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister:G A Hopkins
Event:Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference:P208 IN 1/5
Page_Number:173
Parish_Chapel:Lydbrook


Name: John C W Philpot
Mother's Maiden Name: Williams
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1914
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Gloucestershire, Herefordshire, Hereford and Worcester
Volume: 6a
Page: 794


Year:1940
Month:Sep
Day:28
Grooms_Surname:PHILPOT
Grooms_Forenames:John Charles Webb
Grooms_Age:26
Groom_Condition:Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation:Charge hand
Grooms_Residence:Cambria Cottage Ruardean
Grooms_Fathers_Surname:Philpot
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames:Leopold Archer
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation:Colliery Weighman
Brides_Surname:GRIFFITHS
Brides_Forenames:Laura Cissie Edith
Brides_Age:27
Brides_Condition:Spinster
Brides_Occupation:
Brides_Residence:Crossways Ruardean
Brides_Fathers_Surname:Not Known
Brides_Fathers_Forenames:Not Known
Brides_Fathers_Occupation:
Licence_or_Banns:Licence
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark:Both sign
Witness_1:B H Simmonds
Witness_2:G Griffiths
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister:G J[?] Hilder Rector
Event:Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference:P275 IN 1/26
Page_Number:2
Parish_Chapel:Ruardean

Christine M Philpot Jan-Feb-Mar 1942 Forest of Dean Gloucestershire, Shropshire, Herefordshire
Gerald A Philpot Jul-Aug-Sep 1946 Forest of Dean Nottinghamshire, Derbyshire

Name: Christine M Philpot
Spouse : Michael J Baldwin
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1963
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume Number: 9a
Page Number: 248


Name: Gerald A Philpot
Spouse: Barbara A Tye
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1968
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Herefordshire
Volume Number: 9a
Page Number: 252


Name: John Charles W Philpot
Birth Date: 28 Feb 1914
Date of Registration: Dec 1998
Age at Death: 84
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Gloucestershire, Herefordshire
Register number: 16B
District and Subdistrict: 5241
Entry number: 290

--
Ἀριστοτέλης A Gloster Boy in the Forest of Dean ><((((*>

Albert James WILLIAMS 1895 Moorwood, Lydbrook

by slowhands @, proud of his ancient Dean Forest roots, Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 07:43 (4820 days ago) @ slowhands

Year:1895
Month:Jul
Day:28
Parents_Surname:WILLIAMS
Child_Forenames:Albert James
Fathers_Forenames:John
Mothers_Forenames:Selina
Mothers_Surname:
Residence:Moorwwod Coppice, East Dean
Occupation:Collier
Officiating_Minister:Jacob Wilson
Event:Baptism
Memoranda:Born 1895 Jul 2 Baptised at Reddings
Notes:
Register_Reference:D2598/3/5
Page_Number:18
Parish_Chapel:West Dean Methodist

Year:1918
Month:Nov
Day:23
Grooms_Surname:WILLIAMS
Grooms_Forenames:Albert James
Grooms_Age:23
Groom_Condition:Bachelor
Grooms_Occupation:Miner
Grooms_Residence:Lydbrook
Grooms_Fathers_Surname:WILLIAMS
Grooms_Fathers_Forenames:John
Grooms_Fathers_Occupation:Miner
Brides_Surname:SMITH
Brides_Forenames:Beatrice Ellen
Brides_Age:24
Brides_Condition:Spinster
Brides_Occupation:
Brides_Residence:Lydbrook
Brides_Fathers_Surname:SMITH
Brides_Fathers_Forenames:William
Brides_Fathers_Occupation:Colliery [Overman]
Licence_or_Banns:Licence
Date_of_Banns:
Signature_or_Mark:both sign
Witness_1:Ernest Smith
Witness_2:Frances Harris
Other_Witnesses:
Officiating_Minister:G A Hopkins
Event:Marriage
Memoranda:
Notes:
Register_Reference:P208 IN 1/5
Page_Number:197
Parish_Chapel:Lydbrook

--
Ἀριστοτέλης A Gloster Boy in the Forest of Dean ><((((*>

Laura Cissie E PHILPOT ( nee GRIFFITHS) 1913 - 2004

by slowhands @, proud of his ancient Dean Forest roots, Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 13:08 (4820 days ago) @ slowhands

Name: Laura C E Griffiths
Mother's Maiden Name: Griffiths
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1913
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Gloucestershire, Herefordshire, Hereford and Worcester
Volume: 6a
Page: 821


Name: Laura Cissie E Philpot
Birth Date: 5 Jan 1913
Date of Registration: Mar 2004
Age at Death: 91
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Gloucestershire, Herefordshire
Register number: 20B
District and Subdistrict: 524/1
Entry number: 197

--
Ἀριστοτέλης A Gloster Boy in the Forest of Dean ><((((*>

Memoranda- Albert WILLIAMS ----- born 28 Feb 1914

by Jefff @, West London, Middlesex, Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 14:28 (4820 days ago) @ slowhands

FAO Slowhands, and good afternoon,
re
Memoranda: Parents Albert Williams born 28/11/14
Well done Sir for spotting that this "11" is in fact "II" aka February !

Please can you tell me is this because you've seen the original document and the website BR is a Transcription error, or is it just a piece of highly commendable genius on your part !
Either way well-done and thanks for sorting it out.

Also you posted:
Name: John Charles W Philpot
Birth Date: 28 Feb 1914
Date of Registration: Dec 1998
Age at Death: 84
Registration district: Ross
Inferred County: Gloucestershire, Herefordshire
Register number: 16B
District and Subdistrict: 5241
Entry number: 290

Is it just a coincidence the dates the same or ???, amazing.

Please can you share your source for the above record, thanks. Sorry to no doubt appear dim but I' struggling to keep up and just want to learn

Best regards, Jeff.

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